Yes another Ump gripe.... (look away if ya need to)

[ms244]

Typical MTR post.
"Umpires do what they are told".
Never the umps fault is it?
How about getting some integrity and enforce the rules as written instead of letting someone dictate what rules to enforce?

Why can't a coach get a legal pitcher? Again, it is not illegal until someone calls it. Why pass on or tweak a successful pitcher when they rarely get called.

On one hand MTR states that they can only make calls based on the rules, and then on the other hand he states that he only makes calls that he is told to make.

I'm sure I am in the majority that feels that an umpire making the correct call doesn't make the game look bad. But an umpire either making a bad call, or not making a call at all makes the game look bad.

Look at the obstruction call that just happened in the World Series. Did the umpire that called obstruction make the game look bad, or did he just enforce the rules in the book? Most of the TV coverage that I saw defended the umpire who made the "correct" call. Sure, the game was changed because of the obstruction call/play, but that is what actually happened. When you have umpires that want to change the game and not enforce rule violations that happen, does that make the game look bad, or just the umpires?

Players, coaches, parents & fans shouldn't have to "ask" for certain rules to be enforced. Rules should either be enforced as they are written OR changed/removed from the rule book. To pick and choose what rules you want to enforce is changing the game as it was intended to be played based on the rules that are written.

 

[GOINGDEEP]

College coaches dont just have strong influence, they control the rules and the umpires. Just look at the rule books, the ASA book is about 116 pages including the rules supplements and the college rule book is 288 pages because the college coaches are constantly changing and modifying the rules. As has been indicated, they tried to crack down on the illegal pitches a while back and the entire umpire governing staff was either dismissed or resigned.

I just don't understand how colleges can dictate a written rule? Pitching mechanical rules do not change in college for BB, so why do the powers that "be" allow it in FP? If they ( college coaches ) are all too powerful, why not change the language of the pitching rules and be done with it?

But this also goes beyond college. If the FP college world wants their own set of rules, ok. But that still doesn't answer why the pre-college levels are not calling IP's by the book.

Marriard, good post.
But BB pitching is just as much a learned motion. Very few can do it successfully. FP COULD have deep bullpens too, I don't believe either have a limit that I'm aware of.

 

[RubberBiscuit]

A- Not sure there is any advantage anyway

I also don't see any advantage of Leaping - I wish everyone here in DFP would stop even talking about this meaningless flavor of IP. From my perspective a pitcher can leap anywhere they want to within the pitching lane & circle.

But back to crow-hopping. In this thread's original example, there is this harmless looking 5'6"-ish normal looking girl that pitched for this Nashville team. From initial appearances one might conclude right away that "ya she can't throw that hard".... Then she gets up there and does this huge crow-hop power move (replanting that push foot with the vigor of a tiger downing its prey) where she gets that 60+mph at this 4-foot-closer cheating advantage.

I still ask this question - can anyone produce a video of a pitcher that is under 5'8" that can throw regularly (in a game) over 60mph that does not crow-hop???? I have NEVER seen one. And I have been all over the country seeing sb..... I would love to see at least one.....Anyone??? Bueller ?????

 

[Comp]

I still ask this question - can anyone produce a video of a pitcher that is under 5'8" that can throw regularly (in a game) over 60mph that does not crow-hop???? I have NEVER seen one. And I have been all over the country seeing sb..... I would love to see at least one.....Anyone??? Bueller ?????

Any age restrictions? Lisa Fernandez is only 5' 6" and regularly threw over 60mph in her prime.

 

[BretMan]

I called an illegal pitch (leap) in an 18U college showcase last weekend. So don't say it never happens!

Funny thing was that the pitcher went on to pitch perfectly legal the rest of the game, keeping her pivot foot down with a good drag in the dirt.

 

[GOINGDEEP]

I called an illegal pitch (leap) in an 18U college showcase last weekend. So don't say it never happens!

Funny thing was that the pitcher went on to pitch perfectly legal the rest of the game, keeping her pivot foot down with a good drag in the dirt.

Thank you Bret.

I don't think a lot of umps realize how important their role is for an authority figure to call an IP on young pitchers. As one who is working again with young BB pitchers, for some students who try to push the envelope, once they get "cited" a few times in a game...........the light comes on and they then understand "why they can't do.........".

 

[MTR]

Nice post MTR.

Question. From what I understand the college coaches have strong influence on the IP's not being called. I know WE all love this game, but on the ladder of power sports, softball is near the bottom. How can these coaches push an umpiring org to look away from the written rules?

Let's look at MLB and it's billion dollars of influence. There have been some game changing calls on the biggest stage, the World Series, over the past 3 years. But they ARE written rules whether you like the call or not.

Am I missing something why softball is allowed to look the other way on certain rules?

The difference with the NCAA is that they are a closed shop. Umpires basically audition for associations and assigners determine what umpire goes where. The assignors are paid by the schools, not the umpires. It is not uncommon for coaches who do not care for an umpire, and I'm not saying there aren't umpires who should not be there as there are quite a few, go to the conference and complain about the officiating. There is nothing keeping that conference from dropping their present umpire association and contract with another. The assignor and the association could push back, but what are they going to do when no conference will hire their umpires?

The assignor also has pull as to what umpires get seen and possibly recommended for conference championships and NCAA playoffs. I'm not suggesting that this is some heavy-handed conspiracy out there, but an umpire who ticks off the wrong coach or administrator even for making the correct calls or action, can still discover a cold shoulder in advancement.

In spite of what some reading comprehension challenged people may believe, I am all for calling the rule, first inning opening day to last inning of championship game. I'm also of the opinion that you call what you see, and if you have to go looking for it, there probably wasn't anything to see to begin. BTW, have you ever noticed that these discussions always come up about rule applications that require an umpire's judgment? It isn't the rule that is used as the reasoning for disagreeing, but the judgment.

However, like every other position in this country, an employee or contractor takes direction from the one paying the bills. Yes, there are rules, but the boss tells you how to read them.

AFA MLB, they too are a closed shop.....a closed shop with a union. Yes, they have rules and some calls are often magnified by the importance of the game, but the teams still argue and the game is affected even when the MLB umpires rule properly in accordance with the rule book. Remember Tim McClelland and George Brett's pine tarred bat. The umpire was 100% correct in his ruling and was over-ruled by the commissioner. Are you kidding me?

How about the infield fly last year in ATL? The call was 100% correct and by the book. You think the umpires have not been told to NOT make an IF call on a ball halfway into the outfield? I would be my dead mother's gravestone on that one.

 

[RubberBiscuit]

Any age restrictions? Lisa Fernandez is only 5' 6" and regularly threw over 60mph in her prime.

WOW - just watched her and YES if it is true she averaged mid 60's in her prime then I stand corrected.

As a side note though - she does have a bunch of "linebacker" in her....


Thanks Comp!

 

[cuzmail]

The umpires do what they are told. Why to you think there was such a fluctuation in the NCAA a few years ago? The umpires were told to start enforcing the rule and some of the coaches could not handle it. But if you paid attention to the interviews, the coaches never claimed the calls were incorrect, just that the umpires shouldn't be making them because it made the game look bad. Funny that to me, it was the coach who fails to get a pitcher in the circle that can pitch in accordance with the rule that makes the game look bad.
The entire staff was gone at the end of the year, many resigned when the supervisor was not brought back. That was a direct result of the umpires calling the IP that everyone CLAIMS to want done. Right up until it is and then the umpires are the bad guys for doing what was asked.

I agree and I have stated this very thing on every thread that involved IPs where I have posted.

My point is and always has been. Call it as it is written or get rid of the writing. This way we know what to do and we can adapt as necessary.

Having a rule in the books that isn't enforced or selectively enforced doesn't help anyone including the umpires.

 

[Easton33]

No reading comprehension problem. Plain and simple as you described in your post. Regardless of the rules, umps call what they are told to call by the people paying them. If they are told to look the other way on a certain rule violation by the people that pay them, then they do it. So do they get paid to make calls or to not make them? Is this what you teach your umps? Sellout to the highest bidder or don't make calls that will shorten your paycheck? I thought most umps were in it for love of the game and to stay involved. Did not know there was a clandestine ump prostitution ring going on. Thanks for the enlightenment.

Call it until they decide to change it. The more complaints about the calls even though they are correct, the more likely they will be to change the rule.