Gorilla Gold

[_MIA_]

Haha... I guess you don't want to answer my question... I don't consider what I did to be involved in the game at all... Certainly less involved than the "Fan" cheering "Nice pitch" when the umpire does not give the pitcher the corner and calls a ball. I know, and the umpire knows what that "nice pitch" actually means.

Look, right or wrong, being a part of having a piece of equipment removed certainly entails being more involved (in terms of direct impact on the outcome) in the game then some idiot fan making idiot comments to the umpire. Albeit what you did is certainly less annoying..

Just stick with you don't think being involved as a fan is an issue. That is an easier argument to make..

 

[wheresmycar]

Just stick with you don't think being involved as a fan is an issue.

Sharing info with the coach has no impact on the game. The coach, took that information, and made their own decision. Honestly, after the 2nd inning passed, I assumed they were gonna let it slide.

I could have had the same effect by loudly conversing about the illegal rosin bag with one of the other parents within earshot of the dugout. Is that somehow less offensive? I think that is more intrusive, as now the players are also aware. And, if I had mentioned it to the other parents, the "nice pitch" guy would have been chirping about it instantly...

 

[_MIA_]

Sharing info with the coach has no impact on the game.

So the equipment would have been removed had you not said anything? Come on now….

 

[wheresmycar]

So the equipment would have been removed had you not said anything? Come on now….

Maybe. In 2nd inning, I was convinced coach wasn't going to say anything. I was as surprised as anyone when they finally did call time and ask ump to inspect the bag.

If I had been more prepared, I would have just swung by and said DD left her illegal griping agent in the car. Here it is...

 

[_MIA_]

Maybe. In 2nd inning, I was convinced coach wasn't going to say anything. I was as surprised as anyone when they finally did call time and ask ump to inspect the bag.

If I had been more prepared, I would have just swung by and said DD left her illegal griping agent in the car. Here it is...

So because he didn’t act on it right away you are absolved?

 

[LEsoftballdad]

If you think this is bad, you should see what the PGA used to allow.

 

[Hillhouse]

Haha... I guess you don't want to answer my question... I don't consider what I did to be involved in the game at all... Certainly less involved than the "Fan" cheering "Nice pitch" when the umpire does not give the pitcher the corner and calls a ball. I know, and the umpire knows what that "nice pitch" actually means. But in your eyes, I'm the problem. I am ok with your opinion. Thanks for sharing.

If the umpires had been doing their job well, the rock rosin would have been gone before the first pitch. But I get it... lot of games... schedule to maintain... vast majority of teams would not attempt to use an illegal bag... inspecting rosin bags every game is inefficient. I did not bother the umpire with my observation.

Perhaps if I had come up with a clever way to cheer about rock rosin bags, that would make it ok? "Rock rosin, that's our plan, powdered rosin in the trash can..." Actually, that's pretty good.


18U A level team, committed pitcher, and it's raining. After the rock rosin was removed... she started using a powdered rosin bag... what a shocker. They got the benefit of using the illegal grip enhancer in the rain for roughly half a game. There was no penalty assessed other than removing the illegal bag. And, I'd bet, the rock rosin came right back out in their next game with different umpires. So, even getting caught, its still a net plus from their perspective.

Now, I didn't use "100%" in my post. And I suppose, its possible that in some alternate universe, there is a universe where this young lady pitched for 10ish years, and never learned the difference between rock rosin and powdered rosin... I'm convinced this is not that universe.

On the very remote chance she didn't know the difference, I am proud to have played a very small part in her education.

Fair enough. I apologize for putting words in your mouth, RE: "100%". It wasn't my intent to add more than than you intended. Sorry about that. And I am not being sarcastic.

So, the one thing I would say is, I think you might be over-stating and giving too much benefit to rock rosin, particularly in the rain. I don't think it's THAT big of a difference. I know you're not saying this (and I'm NOT putting words in your mouth again!!! lol) but lets be honest, this isn't the difference between someone becoming Cat Osterman 2.0 with it. Now, that doesn't change the legality of it. On that point, you're right 100%. By rule, Rock rosin is illegal. That's not in dispute. And rules are rules. I don't want to turn this into the whole crow hopping debate, where people often justify it somewhat by saying "she's not getting an advantage".

Rosin, sometimes loses it's helpfulness in rain. It's great for soaking up sweat and drying the hand but, once the rosin itself gets wet, Powder rosin in particular gets ruined. Rock rosin can still apply some stick but the drying agent gets lost. So, pardon the pun but, its then a wash as to it's effectiveness. Of course, there can be more to it than the rosin itself. If this girl became accustomed to having it, then it's taken away, that can shake someone up and get in her head.

9 of 10 times, when a pitcher has rosin, he/she throws it on the ground and leaves it there between innings. I would usually ask if I can use theirs's if I didn't have my own, and I'd have others ask to use mine. Now and then a pitcher would pick it up and take it with them between innings. And I've even had umpires tell the pitcher it's required for them to leave the rosin out there, they weren't allowed to take it in the dugout with them. @The Man In Blue is there such a rule? Now and then, umpires will "over-umpire" and insert their own rules and themselves in games needlessly. But I've seen it happen, more than once. That always seemed like BS to me.

 

[El Oso]

I don't consider what I did to be involved in the game at all... Certainly less involved than the "Fan" cheering "Nice pitch" when the umpire does not give the pitcher the corner and calls a ball.

 

[Cougars]

If you think this is bad, you should see what the PGA used to allow.

I’d like this 100 times if i could

 

[wheresmycar]

So because he didn’t act on it right away you are absolved?

Not looking for absolution. I own what I did, and given same circumstances, I would do it again. As we both have established, you are entitled to your opinion.

Fair enough. I apologize for putting words in your mouth, RE: "100%". It wasn't my intent to add more than than you intended. Sorry about that. And I am not being sarcastic.

So, the one thing I would say is, I think you might be over-stating and giving too much benefit to rock rosin, particularly in the rain. I don't think it's THAT big of a difference. I know you're not saying this (and I'm NOT putting words in your mouth again!!! lol) but lets be honest, this isn't the difference between someone becoming Cat Osterman 2.0 with it. Now, that doesn't change the legality of it. On that point, you're right 100%. By rule, Rock rosin is illegal. That's not in dispute. And rules are rules. I don't want to turn this into the whole crow hopping debate, where people often justify it somewhat by saying "she's not getting an advantage".

Rosin, sometimes loses it's helpfulness in rain. It's great for soaking up sweat and drying the hand but, once the rosin itself gets wet, Powder rosin in particular gets ruined. Rock rosin can still apply some stick but the drying agent gets lost. So, pardon the pun but, its then a wash as to it's effectiveness. Of course, there can be more to it than the rosin itself. If this girl became accustomed to having it, then it's taken away, that can shake someone up and get in her head.

9 of 10 times, when a pitcher has rosin, he/she throws it on the ground and leaves it there between innings. I would usually ask if I can use theirs's if I didn't have my own, and I'd have others ask to use mine. Now and then a pitcher would pick it up and take it with them between innings. And I've even had umpires tell the pitcher it's required for them to leave the rosin out there, they weren't allowed to take it in the dugout with them. @The Man In Blue is there such a rule? Now and then, umpires will "over-umpire" and insert their own rules and themselves in games needlessly. But I've seen it happen, more than once. That always seemed like BS to me.

These days pitchers are taking their rosin bags back to the dugout, covid protocols, prohibited sharing the same rosin bag. As far as I can tell, NFHS (PGF) rules do not specify. I think ASA rules state bag should be left on field, but then Covid.

I agree powdered rosin bags do not hold up in wet conditions, they can get gummed up pretty quickly. I try to always have spares available in my tournament bag.

Pine Rosin, is Insoluble in water, which, you know if you ever got pine sap on your car, soap and water will not get it off. (Pro tip, rubbing alcohol will quickly dissolve pine sap on your car and probably the wax too). So wet conditions would not prevent rock rosin from adhering to the hand and ball.

Anyway, if all of the other hundreds of pitchers at this tournament are having to struggle gripping the wet ball, why should this pitcher get the advantage (real or perceived) of something not available to the other pitchers who did not pack their illegal gripping agent for the trip? Especially given there is a legal alternative, like the GG towel.