Bottom of the roster

[CoogansBluff]

Yes , it is tough. But , that's just the way it is. Probably finding a team that is better suited for your current ability might be the best option.

But you invited her on your team, which I assume means you believed she had the skill to play this level. Now, you're saying that finding another team that is better suited for her current abilities might be the best option. If she's not working hard, I get that. But assuming she did the work, what happened? Did you misjudge her abilities? Did you fail to develop her? Did you give her every chance to succeed (ie, let her bat in bracket games)?

 

[CycloneSoftball22]

But you invited her on your team, which I assume means you believed she had the skill to play this level. Now, you're saying that finding another team that is better suited for her current abilities might be the best option. If she's not working hard, I get that. But assuming she did the work, what happened? Did you misjudge her abilities? Did you fail to develop her? Did you give her every chance to succeed (ie, let her bat in bracket games)?

This does happen and I would say it has happened to most coaches. A kid looks great during tryouts (and sometimes during practice) , but doesn't perform at all during games. When/if a kid doesn't develop , it isn't always the coach fault. It just is what it is. There are some players that have separated themselves from the pack and thus they get the bulk of the playing time in bracket. Those that aren't getting many opportunities, just simply fell behind. Also , every chance to succeed may have come in pool play AB's. If the player doesn't play well there , how could you put them in place of another player that does?

 

[CoogansBluff]

This does happen and I would say it has happened to most coaches. A kid looks great during tryouts (and sometimes during practice) , but doesn't perform at all during games. When/if a kid doesn't develop , it isn't always the coach fault. It just is what it is. There are some players that have separated themselves from the pack and thus they get the bulk of the playing time in bracket. Those that aren't getting many opportunities, just simply fell behind

Yes, it has happened to every coach. My point wasn't to blame, but to question whether a coach should take more responsibility for that misjudgment. If you take 11, and one stinks, and she sits, that doesn't hurt the coach or team that much. But it hurts the kid, who doesn't play and therefore is limited in her opportunity to get better.

What would happen if your philosophy instead were this -- I'm taking 11 and I'm batting everybody, every time. You will get every opportunity to succeed. I might make an exception for an ASA qualifier, or ASA nationals, but for the rest, everybody bats. That way, I share the responsibility for player selection and player development. You the player must work hard and do everything I ask, which might mean keeping a log of how often you're hitting so I'll know you're doing your part. But if I pick you, you will play.

If you did that, how would things change for your team?

 

[CycloneSoftball22]

Yes, it has happened to every coach. My point wasn't to blame, but to question whether a coach should take more responsibility for that misjudgment. If you take 11, and one stinks, and she sits, that doesn't hurt the coach or team that much. But it hurts the kid, who doesn't play and therefore is limited in her opportunity to get better.

What would happen if your philosophy instead were this -- I'm taking 11 and I'm batting everybody, every time. You will get every opportunity to succeed. I might make an exception for an ASA qualifier, or ASA nationals, but for the rest, everybody bats. That way, I share the responsibility for player selection and player development. You the player must work hard and do everything I ask, which might mean keeping a lot of how often you're hitting so I'll know you're doing your part. But if I pick you, you will play.

If you did that, how would things change for your team?

Most likely , the result would be frustration for the players that have separated themselves and I would be having to look for newer players next year. I think age group plays a big part in these scenarios. Your solution is acceptable up to probably 14u and then things just have to change. Also , since the development of the kid tends to be this issue here .... How does saying I will bat you in every game EXCEPT the ones that are important (Nationals , Qualifiers , etc) help the confidence level of the player. How is that any different than telling them they haven't earned their spot in the top 9 during bracket play?

 

[soonerfan1966]

what happens to the sport after a few generations when all the kids that wasnt given a chance to play, decide their kids wont be done that way. not all of your "elite" players will have elite babies.

 

[CycloneSoftball22]

what happens to the sport after a few generations when all the kids that wasnt given a chance to play, decide their kids wont be done that way. not all of your "elite" players will have elite babies.

Actually , I would say that most of the better coaches weren't "elite" players. The sport will be just fine. The kids typically understand why they aren't playing as much as they would like. It is the parents that have the problem with it.

 

[CoogansBluff]

Most likely , the result would be frustration for the players that have separated themselves and I would be having to look for newer players next year.

That’s certainly possible. My DD has played on teams that advocate my philosophy (six seasons now, through 14U), and I’ve never experienced any frustration like you say. But the rosters have been small (11 max), and half the time there is a player out or hurt and you’re batting 10. Batting 9 or 10, and even 11 sometimes, is not that bothersome to most kids, IMO.

I think age group plays a big part in these scenarios. Your solution is acceptable up to probably 14u and then things just have to change.

My DD is just finishing 14U. There is probably some truth in what you say. I’ll wait a couple of years to comment.

Also , since the development of the kid tends to be this issue here .... How does saying I will bat you in every game EXCEPT the ones that are important (Nationals , Qualifiers , etc) help the confidence level of the player. How is that any different than telling them they haven't earned their spot in the top 9 during bracket play?

You're not playing ASA qualifiers that often, and in those, you have no choice but to bat 9. I mentioned ASA qualifiers just to concede that some teams have certain goals that might make batting nine more appropriate.

But note that my idea of batting the full roster isn’t about my fear that the player will lose confidence or have her feelings hurt. I I were worried about that, I'd pick names from a hat to determine the batting order. My issue is opportunity. You can’t get better from the bench. And it's hard to get better batting primarily vs. pool pitchers.

And finally, I appreciate your responses to this. Obviously, I have a philosophy on player development and playing time that is not shared by all. Your view might be the more common approach. I enjoy a healthy debate about it.

 

[CycloneSoftball22]

That’s certainly possible. My DD has played on teams that advocate my philosophy (six seasons now, through 14U), and I’ve never experienced any frustration like you say. But the rosters have been small (11 max), and half the time there is a player out or hurt and you’re batting 10. Batting 9 or 10, and even 11 sometimes, is not that bothersome to most kids, IMO.


My DD is just finishing 14U. There is probably some truth in what you say. I’ll wait a couple of years to comment.



You're not playing ASA qualifiers that often, and in those, you have no choice but to bat 9. I mentioned ASA qualifiers just to concede that some teams have certain goals that might make batting nine more appropriate.

But note that my idea of batting the full roster isn’t about my fear that the player will lose confidence or have her feelings hurt. I I were worried about that, I'd pick names from a hat to determine the batting order. My issue is opportunity. You can’t get better from the bench. And it's hard to get better batting primarily vs. pool pitchers.

And finally, I appreciate your responses to this. Obviously, I have a philosophy on player development and playing time that is not shared by all. Your view might be the more common approach. I enjoy a healthy debate about it.

I enjoy it as well. To think that there is only one correct approach would be short sided for either of us. We have a current situation on the 14u team in our organization right now where there is a player that hits OK , but isn't up to speed on defense and is behind some other players. The coach always puts her in the batting LU , but only plays her on D about one out of every 3 games. The parents aren't happy with that situation either. They believe being in the batting LU isn't enough. So , even when the coach does try to get as much playing time as possible for a player , somehow he is wrong.

 

[CoogansBluff]

The kids typically understand why they aren't playing as much as they would like. It is the parents that have the problem with it.

Kids are generally going to do what coaches tell them and think that's just the way it is. Sometimes it takes an adult advocate to say, ''We played four games today, and my daughter only played in one? Really?''

 

[starsnuffer]

When I said "play the ones you want to keep", that includes the ones you want to continue to develop. It does not mean "play the best players". Sometimes the "best players" are annoying and have personality issues and you don't actually want to keep them.

-W