barrel/hand pivot point, a.k.a TTB

[julray]

Julray,

Being too short to the ball is cutting out the back swing which affects your ability to get on plane early.

You guys are taking hitters posing while getting the hands in front of the body, creating a steep barrel path to contact. You are talking about pushing the hands.

Then there is this which you said you can’t explain it any better.



Everything mentioned is about pushing the hand and barrel forward.

As Hank Aaron said in his book you don’t want to completely take away the back swing.

What you are saying if you believe in the above description is your taking away the ability to get on plane early.

Once again if you take Altuve’s swing in the very first post of this thread, he isn’t doing what is said in the above statement.

Please explain what bat lag position is? What happens to the barrel when getting to bat lag position from a FYB position? Is posture important in getting behind the ball early and staying through the ball? Where are the hands in a FYB position? You guys have steep stuck in your brain, your stuck in an endless loop because you keep seeing the Pujois demo. Once you put it all together, you will understand.

The swing needs to be launched from a good leveraged position, and proper posture needs to be established and maintained throughout the swing. Steep will not be a problem if you learn to use the body properly which is much important to me than some hand gimmick.

 

[james27503]

Julray,

Being too short to the ball is cutting out the back swing which affects your ability to get on plane early.

You guys are taking hitters posing while getting the hands in front of the body, creating a steep barrel path to contact. You are talking about pushing the hands.

Then there is this which you said you can’t explain it any better.



Everything mentioned is about pushing the hand and barrel forward.

As Hank Aaron said in his book you don’t want to completely take away the back swing.

What you are saying if you believe in the above description is your taking away the ability to get on plane early.

Once again if you take Altuve’s swing in the very first post of this thread, he isn’t doing what is said in the above statement.

Really???,

Down to = shortest path to bat to bat lag. 0:00 to 0:12. Then from 0:12 to 0:15 chop chop chop.



If you can't see it fine. Go try it. Post a video of you trying what I just said. Try to pull the knob to the bat lag position directly down to forward (or under), then when the bat is level to the ground and the knob is facing the pitcher chop. Show us how is doesn't work. Tell us what you are going to do and then do it. Prove us wrong by video.

I did that, thinking, I will show them. Of course, to swing down I had to keep my posture almost straight up and zero turn. As soon as I fixed my posture and turned my body to bat lag that same chop turned into hitting missiles. You will know it when you do it. It immediately took guess work out of hitting. Took real complex calculations my brain was doing to hit and made it real simple and direct.

What have you got to lose?, just try it.

 

[_MIA_]

I did that, thinking, I will show them. Of course, to swing down I had to keep my posture almost straight up and zero turn. As soon as I fixed my posture and turned my body to bat lag that same chop turned into hitting missiles. You will know it when you do it. It immediately took guess work out of hitting. Took real complex calculations my brain was doing to hit and made it real simple and direct.

What have you got to lose?, just try it.

If you are able to get a HL barrel path then that is all that matters...as @Mudders Brudder has stated a number of times in the last week or so and which I agree with. Do you have videos of your paths before and after the change?

 

[Bobby Shirer]

I guess I'm having difficulty getting my point(s) across. If you listen to Yelich, he wasn't - attempting to swing "down to" - he was "attempting to hit the front of the plate" with the ball. Once he accomplished that, he was, "attempting to hit the ground 6' out in front of the plate"....then a "LD", and then just launching it to the back of the cage (I think I remember him doing the last back of the cage part, but not 100% positive, and I'm not gonna go listen again...doesn't really matter for the discussion).

Do you understand the difference in attempting to do something that's objective (hit a particular spot in the cage with the ball) vs attempting to do something that's subjective (feel that you "swing down", but with no true measuring gauge to know if you're swing "down to" is the same as someone else's swing "down to")?

That's what I got from it. The only time you're in a position to swing down as though you're gonna hit the plate with the ball is at the very start and you go all out swinging down. Then, to hit the ball in the air you adjust nearly everything, elevate the front elbow, get on pitch plane, rotate the hips.....
To me it promotes swinging hard from go. Since the bat initially is moving down and back, (we start with it pointed up BTW) that means swinging down.
After that, the swing is forward and up. How else are you going to hit the ball forward in the air?
Yelich admitted as much during the interview, saying he's not hitting down but the drill promoted a feel.
Has anybody else tried the drill or are they all talking outta their necks?

 

[james27503]

That's what I got from it. The only time you're in a position to swing down as though you're gonna hit the plate with the ball is at the very start and you go all out swinging down. Then, to hit the ball in the air you adjust nearly everything, elevate the front elbow, get on pitch plane, rotate the hips.....
To me it promotes swinging hard from go. Since the bat initially is moving down and back, (we start with it pointed up BTW) that means swinging down.
After that, the swing is forward and up. How else are you going to hit the ball forward in the air?
Yelich admitted as much during the interview, saying he's not hitting down but the drill promoted a feel.
Has anybody else tried the drill or are they all talking outta their necks?

I did this with both my daughter 13 and son 9 yesterday. It takes the loop out of the swing. I have a hack attack pitching machine. Previously she hit pretty good before but when she missed, it was under with a bit of loop. She would have a bomb here and there with some nasty arounds rolled over to the 3rd base side. By then end of the session she was hitting consistent missiles to the back of the cage. Almost effortlessly. In a 13 year olds way she said "all I have to do is lean over, turn and chop the ball, it is so weird how that works."

My son did well with it too but at 9 by the time we got to hitting the back of the cage he was mentally done. Then took an outside one off the end and hurt his itty bitty hands, ahh get tough boy!!!

 

[Bobby Shirer]

Donaldson and Yelich have different approaches but is the swing the same or different?

 

[james27503]

If you are able to get a HL barrel path then that is all that matters...as @Mudders Brudder has stated a number of times in the last week or so and which I agree with. Do you have videos of your paths before and after the change?

Here is a video of me before I discovered the change. My mind set here was down to from behind. Golf but higher T. What I see in this now is a bit of a loop. I will try to get a new video. I do know that I was struggling to hit constantly off the machine coming in over 80 from 40'. It is zero time for any errors. You have to nail every aspect.



Since the I have fixed my gather, my forward move advancing the sagittal plane, this is done by using the gather to lift the front foot. If you do that you create smooth controlled forward move that is downhill. Then I really want to feel a good FYB and be completely, totally balanced. I focused on this drill by Josh Donaldson. Best FYB drill for me.



Then I moved to the idea of the first move after FYB is achieved to pull the knob of the bat as fast and hard as I could down \ under directly toward the pitcher and then once at bat lag position my mind is saying chop chop. I am hitting straight up seeds and it really isn't even that hard lol. I have been so confident I now "show off" to the other dads of my travel ball players. I get them in the cage and let them give it a go. After they struggle mightily, I then confidently go in there and hit 3 or 4 piss rockets and walk out and they look dumbfounded. It works, at least it has for me.

 

[_MIA_]

I will try to get a new video.

Thanks. Looking forward to it. Post it at real speed if possible.

 

[james27503]

Donaldson and Yelich have different approaches but is the swing the same or different?View attachment 17563View attachment 17564

Don't be fooled by the Yelich still. He still has 2 ft of bat travel before contact. In this space he is going to get palm up. If you saw the video and not a still you would see him getting to palm up. Josh is not palm up at contact. That is the difference.

 

[Bobby Shirer]

I did this with both my daughter 13 and son 9 yesterday. It takes the loop out of the swing. I have a hack attack pitching machine. Previously she hit pretty good before but when she missed, it was under with a bit of loop. She would have a bomb here and there with some nasty arounds rolled over to the 3rd base side. By then end of the session she was hitting consistent missiles to the back of the cage. Almost effortlessly. In a 13 year olds way she said "all I have to do is lean over, turn and chop the ball, it is so weird how that works."

My son did well with it too but at 9 by the time we got to hitting the back of the cage he was mentally done. Then took an outside one off the end and hurt his itty bitty hands, ahh get tough boy!!!

I know what you mean. See if this fits.....the effect of forward force on the bat causes the barrel to go rearward and turn around the hands.
Applying torque to the handle from go to contact cleans everything up.
What I've experienced is that an aggressive first move eliminates bat lag.
When the bat lags, any upward movement of the hands is going to make the barrel go downward and you'll get under the ball. Keeping the bat rotating around fixed hands eliminates the sudden upward force. The force becomes consistent and easily predictable.
Show your girl the DiCarlo move and see what happens.