About the Drop

[Fury_Mike]

one tip that I've used is to bring your chin down at release. In effect, it helps get your posture slightly forward and "over your front foot"

 

[Hillhouse]

So if a pitcher already has 6-12 spin, do you just call it a drop and move on to the next pitch? If the spin is right, is it just a matter of throwing it harder to get more drop? I guess I'm confused by the "extra topspin" phrase - in your opinion, is a drop ball just a FB with 6-12 spin, or is there something else that needs to occur (other than increasing spin rate) to get more downward movement?

I don't get that extra topspin bit either. Unless the pitcher is purposefully trying to take something off the ball (changing speeds, not changing up) then I cannot fathom why someone would not want max speed and max spin on each and every pitch.

If a pitcher has 6/12 spin, then it's not just a question of moving to the next pitch because that pitcher needs command first. I mean, 6/12 rotation is pretty pointless if the ball is flat or angled high. So the command has to be there.

 

[radness]

I tell them they have a topspin fastball and that some people will call it a drop. Since it's also their fastball they are already throwing it at max velocity. It seems that whenever I tell them to put extra top spin on the ball by tipping back their wrist or releasing it earlier or 'peeling' up the back of the ball they lose some consistency. I've worked with pitchers that have a 6-12 fastball and a drop and I don't seeing much of a difference. If I had a RevFire I might think differently. Whenever I catch for one my pitchers I frequently give them feedback on their spin. It's common for a pitcher to throw a different spin, and when I bring it to their attention, they have no idea what they did differently.

A typical fastball that I see has topspin with the axis tipped about 30 degrees off line. In this case we'll work on a 6-12 spin pitch. Sometimes they will keep both pitches, sometimes the 6-12 becomes the fastball.

Interesting...
So you dont teach a drop.
But you tell people with top spin they are throwing a top spin fastball and some people call it a drop.
That sounds liked a mixed message.
Do you explain your reasonings for your verbage choice vs. Why others call it a drop?

What is the fastball spin you see with the 30% angle doing?
Stays flat?
Because then you teach/change it to
over the top 6-12 spin.
Why? In your view, what changes come of that pitch trajectory/outcome?

Then you comment sometimes they keep the 30% axis pitch and develop
over the top 6-12. Keep both.
What is the difference you see?

 

[Bullseye]

If I had a RevFire I might think differently.







Whenever I catch for one my pitchers I frequently give them feedback on their spin. It's common for a pitcher to throw a different spin, and when I bring it to their attention, they have no idea what they did differently.

A typical fastball that I see has topspin with the axis tipped about 30 degrees off line. In this case we'll work on a 6-12 spin pitch. Sometimes they will keep both pitches, sometimes the 6-12 becomes the fastball.

If your are trying to teach pitching. And actually saying you may think differently if.
You need this more than they do.

 

[Hillhouse]

Rev fire's tell you how fast the ball is spinning, not if it's spinning correctly.

 

[Ken B]

Interesting...
So you dont teach a drop.
But you tell people with top spin they are throwing a top spin fastball and some people call it a drop.
That sounds liked a mixed message.
Do you explain your reasonings for your verbage choice vs. Why others call it a drop?

What is the fastball spin you see with the 30% angle doing?
Stays flat?
Because then you teach/change it to
over the top 6-12 spin.
Why? In your view, what changes come of that pitch trajectory/outcome?

Then you comment sometimes they keep the 30% axis pitch and develop
over the top 6-12. Keep both.
What is the difference you see?

When working with girls who have had some instruction or exposure to ideas about the drop, many believe they need to contort or release the ball a certain way. The pitch might have good spin, but is slower.

Teaching a fastball then showing them how to throw it with 12/6 spin results in a more natural motion while maintaining speed.

Teaching spin awareness is critical. If they understand the basics of spin, teaching pitches is much easier.

I tell kids to keep their FB while working on the drop and change. They’re often pleasantly surprised when a coach asks if they have a screw ball and they show their FB on the inside corner . It’s also just a good inside pitch until they develop a rise.

 

[Ken B]

For kids who have good spin but struggle to keep it low, I have the girls adjust their point of aim until the ball locates at the knees.

 

[ArmWhip]

I have seen pitchers with a drop and a 6-12 spin fastball that look identical. If so what is the purpose of keeping both or saying you have both? If I had a RevFire and it showed a significant difference in RPM I might be more inclined not to trust my perception.

I always look at pitches in terms of the pitcher's overall arsenal. If a pitcher throws a 'drop' that is noticeably slower than their off axis fastball both have value. 'Drop' down in the zone, fastball at the top of the zone. And you also have to take into account the pitcher's ability to locate each of their pitches. A pitch that misses it's location has less value regardless of how much break or velocity it has.

There are only general rules when it comes to these things, each pitcher is an individual creation. My job is to accentuate their strengths, improve their weaknesses and make sure they understand both.

 

[radness]

When working with girls who have had some instruction or exposure to ideas about the drop, many believe they need to contort or release the ball a certain way. The pitch might have good spin, but is slower.

Teaching a fastball then showing them how to throw it with 12/6 spin results in a more natural motion while maintaining speed.

Teaching spin awareness is critical. If they understand the basics of spin, teaching pitches is much easier.

I tell kids to keep their FB while working on the drop and change. They’re often pleasantly surprised when a coach asks if they have a screw ball and they show their FB on the inside corner . It’s also just a good inside pitch until they develop a rise.

Like your use of the word 'contort'.
The body figuring out what the brain wants it to do.
Can be pretty awkward going through the process.
Perfect word!

Nice to read you incorporate drop in your teachings!

 

[Gags]

What's the correlation b/w spin rate and drop? i.e. - 40 mph / 50 mph pitch, how much more does the ball drop for each X increase in spin? Is this "chartable"? 2000 rpm over 40' = x inches, vs. 2400 rpm. I'm guessing on the rpms - I don't have that chart that was posted a few weeks ago up in front of me that showed TB/HS/D1 spin rates, so I'm not sure what the actual difference in rpm is b/w a FB and DB.

Maybe there's too many variables? I would expect there to be a difference (in height change) when comparing a bullet spin FB to a 12-6 DB, but is it also significant b/w a 12-6 FB and a 12-6 DB? Is the "contortion" to get the extra (100/200/300?) rpm worth it?