Timing differences between pitching swing back vs out of glove

[lostcreek1]

If you have one girl that pitches out of her glove, and another than utilizes a swing back motion. What do they do different to account for the large difference between the starting positions of the hand, so that they time up the same at the 9-12-3 o'clock positions. Does one have to move her arm faster does one have to delay moving hand forward longer, or does one or the other have to move the lower half faster or slower than the other etc etc for the hands to end up in the same position in correlation with the lower half of there body as the other one at 9-12-3. This is something I have been thinking about lately, or maybe I should just quit thinking so much.

 

[Bullseye]

They are both arm to body sequencing.
Timing arm location with when the body moves to generate energy. A pitcher doing one versus the other could learn the other it would just take timing.

 

[tomorrow]

If you have one girl that pitches out of her glove, and another than utilizes a swing back motion. What do they do different to account for the large difference between the starting positions of the hand, so that they time up the same at the 3-12-9 o'clock positions. Does one have to move her arm faster does one have to delay moving hand forward longer, or does one or the other have to move the lower half faster or slower than the other etc etc for the hands to end up in the same position in correlation with the lower half of there body as the other one at 3-12-9. This is something I have been thinking about lately, or maybe I should just quit thinking so much.

I believe this is a very valid question. One that I have not seen any real answer for. The answer has to be one or a combo of these. To make the body timing the same between "in glove" and "out of glove" you have to :
1. Jump out less distant
2. Push the glove down more than out during the push-out
3. Have a hitch some where in the windup as mens fastpitch does.

 

[Fluid Fastpitch]

I feel like in out of glove the arm motion starts slower, but catches up sometime around 10 o'clock. I have no data though aside from video. I would like to page @Rick Pauly for some 4G motion data. Would love to know the difference in acceleration.
I don't believe the drive needs to be impacted.

 

[lostcreek1]

I believe this is a very valid question. One that I have not seen any real answer for. The answer has to be one or a combo of these. To make the body timing the same between "in glove" and "out of glove" you have to :
1. Jump out less distant
2. Push the glove down more than out during the push-out
3. Have a hitch some where in the windup as mens fastpitch does.

So are saying the out of the glove pitcher would have to slow down or pause somewhere due the swing back hand traveling a lot faster when it reaches the hip vs the out of the glove hand starting from the hip.

 

[tomorrow]

If we assume the pitcher is trying to move the pitching arm at the same speed no matter the pre-pitch style.
For those with a backswing, the hips start forward while the pitching hand is still going back.
For those out of the glove, the hips start forward at the same time as the ball/ glove.
Those with a backswing have more time to get to a solid Front side resistance if the lower half movement is kept constant.

Btw I am just looking for answers also since this is a question that I have not seen addressed.

 

[ArmWhip]

It's not really a conscious thing. The ball should be at about 3 o'clock when the drive foot leaves the rubber. The exact sequencing will vary from pitcher to pitcher depending on things like; when does the ball/hand come out of the glove, how fast is a pitcher's upswing etc. You could ask the same question about timing when a pitcher does 'walk ins' or does long toss. It takes some trial and error before the body catches on.

 

[lostcreek1]

It's not really a conscious thing. The ball should be at about 3 o'clock when the drive foot leaves the rubber. The exact sequencing will vary from pitcher to pitcher depending on things like; when does the ball/hand come out of the glove, how fast is a pitcher's upswing etc. You could ask the same question about timing when a pitcher does 'walk ins' or does long toss. It takes some trial and error before the body catches on.

So the ball needs to be at 3 when the foot leaves the rubber and about 10-9 when the front foot lands. But what Do they do to make this happen when they have vastly different starting points. I guess you would need a video of two pitchers synced up to see what happened between start and 3 to see.

 

[Rolling Hard]

"Synced up."
Should PI experiment with their students on how to sync up for max velo?
I recall a guy said he purposely cut a students stride down 5 or 6 inches because she was actually slowing her arm down in order to sync up and she gained 5 mph in one lesson???? Maybe if he added a hitch or a way of delaying her arm action and left her stride alone she would have gained 7 mph??

 

[ArmWhip]

So the ball needs to be at 3 when the foot leaves the rubber and about 10-9 when the front foot lands. But what Do they do to make this happen when they have vastly different starting points. I guess you would need a video of two pitchers synced up to see what happened between start and 3 to see.

You're dealing with something that can vary a lot from pitcher to pitcher so you're not going to get a definitive answer because the body figures it out, and interference from the thinking mind only complicates things. For instance; some pitchers come out of the glove at 6 o'clock and some as late as 3 o'clock. Some pitchers have very long, high backswings like Amanda Scarborough and some barely get back past 6 o'clock. Some pitchers have fast arm circles, others have a more measured tempo. There is a loose relationship between the stride leg and throwing arm, they both come up together, so a pitcher with a backswing is going to have start her arm motion earlier or delay her push off in comparison to an OOG pitcher who can start the two at roughly the same time.