Shamrocks 14U Pitcher

[bwalk63]

I understand why you think it is not real I am always skeptical as well. But this is real and she was gunned at a college camp with a real radar gun. And you can bet that Div 1 schools out east know who she is and that it is real. So take it for what it is worth, if you don't believe it that is ok no biggie. I agree most dads will add a few miles an hour to their daughters pitches. I for one don't but I am an egnima. But college coaches have no reason to lie about that.

 

[mudbug]

I understand why you think it is not real I am always skeptical as well. But this is real and she was gunned at a college camp with a real radar gun. And you can bet that Div 1 schools out east know who she is and that it is real. So take it for what it is worth, if you don't believe it that is ok no biggie. I agree most dads will add a few miles an hour to their daughters pitches. I for one don't but I am an egnima. But college coaches have no reason to lie about that.

I have no knowledge of her but what I read here, but I dont have any problem believeing its real either. Every year there are girls that top 65 at 14U. They will top 60 at 12U. Seen them, theres not a lot, maybe a couple per state, but they exist. Watched girls 12U softball LL world series on TV a few yrs ago, the pitching was clocked and displayed, I recall a solid 59-61 mph on most pitches from one particular12yo pitcher.

There were hits off her too.

 

[mrslug01]

I remember her too. She was a tall kid, from Georgia I think, that was at 60 alomost every pitch. And the team they were facing had a kid throwing a constant 48. I remeber thinking that proves the radar gun isn't broken.

 

[fpitch11]

The Shamrock pitcher's speed is very impressive in light of her apparent size. There are kids each year throwing very hard at younger age groups. I would suspect it is due to better instruction, stronger athletes, greater pool of talent in the sport, etc. Most second year 14u pitchers that would be close to that speed range will probably be playing 16u or 18u, so she should stand out even more this year.

The LL pitcher you refer to is now 14 and throwing in the 67-68 range. She was taught to pitch by Rick Pauly.

 

[Renntiger]

According to her profile on softballshowcase.com, She is 5'6", same as Lisa Fernandez and Taryn Mowatt, both of whom can throw hard, so I gather the height part is not the most surprising aspect of her performance. However, based on the one photo of her shown on the Shamrocks team page (assuming it's current), she just doesn't seem to have the muscular build we see in relatively short but fast pitchers like Fernandez and Mowatt; so where is she getting all that extraordinary power? Surely her pitching mechanics are not vastly superior to those of Fernandez and Mowatt, both of whom are already plenty extraordinary in their own right? If she can generate Lisa Fernandez's explosive power using half the muscle mass and no additional leverage, I think we can all learn something by studying her motion through videos or even stills. It would be great if those who have access to these educational materials can find a way to post them here. If this girl continues to grow and develop, we'll be hearing about her and watching her play sooner or later anyway, so why not some exclusive previews for the true aficionados?

Gene

 

[bwalk63]

According to her profile on softballshowcase.com, She is 5'6", same as Lisa Fernandez and Taryn Mowatt, both of whom can throw hard, so I gather the height part is not the most surprising aspect of her performance. However, based on the one photo of her shown on the Shamrocks team page (assuming it's current), she just doesn't seem to have the muscular build we see in relatively short but fast pitchers like Fernandez and Mowatt; so where is she getting all that extraordinary power? Surely her pitching mechanics are not vastly superior to those of Fernandez and Mowatt, both of whom are already plenty extraordinary in their own right? If she can generate Lisa Fernandez's explosive power using half the muscle mass and no additional leverage, I think we can all learn something by studying her motion through videos or even stills. It would be great if those who have access to these educational materials can find a way to post them here. If this girl continues to grow and develop, we'll be hearing about her and watching her play sooner or later anyway, so why not some exclusive previews for the true aficionados?

Gene

Gene,

I do have pics of her pitching but I am not at liberty to post them, I wish I could, her arm whip is where she is probably getting most of her speed. But without seeing a video of her(I don't have one, but am working on it) it is touch to tell. I can tell you that when the ball is about 10 o'clock she looks alot like the best pitchers, her drive leg is under her throwing shoulder and she is loaded. I had started a thread a few weeks ago about getting into this position but it didn't really go anywhere, I don't think I was explaining my question correctly. Any way at release you can see that she is giving it her all.

 

[mrslug01]

Seems to me we can study this but the ability for a relatively thin 5'6 14 year old to throw 65mph is alot more genetic than it is mechanics. Kinda like Hussein Bolt coming along shattering the 100 yard dash. Some things just don't make sense. There are alot of major league pitchers, most of whom have pretty good mechanics. Why can some throw 100 and others barely 90?
I think that's the funny thing about pitching. My DD is 13 almost 14 and throws low 50's with good movement. She's 5'6, 130 and very strong. She also has a great bat and power. I continue to monitor where she's at because I don't want her to miss the boat long term looking to pitch if she doesn't continue to devleop the speed. I think she's on track now but the way she hit's I don't want her to miss that boat. I wish she would wake up and throw 60 tomorrow lol. Would make it easier.

 

[Ken Krause]

I agree with Mrslug01 that from the descriptions posted it is probably largely genetics -- sight unseen. A lot of kids that age and size don't throw that hard despite having good mechanics, so it can't simply be mechanics alone. Unless she is doing something vastly different from the norm, in which case it would definitely be worth studying what she does to see if it can apply to everyone else.

The odds are when she was born the softball gods reached down, touched her arm and made it a thunderbolt. It happens. No doubt she works hard to maximize her gifts and all that. But she likely still has a huge advantage that you can't teach.

 

[Renntiger]

Height is genetic; muscle composition is genetic. A genetic attribute can be any number of things, but it is always definable, and is necessarily confined to work within the constraints of basic human anatomy and laws of physics. If a smaller person manages to consistently outperform larger competitors at a physical challenge that normally favors size, and if we set aside the variables of training and techniques for a moment, then he/she may very well be relying on some other superior physical attribute(s) to compensate for his/her deficiency in size. The compensation mechanism can be studied, and would be of interest to others who seek to excel at the same challenge, whether or not they face a similar predicament.

It's certainly possible, if not probable, that this girl is blessed with exceptional genes, but she is still 100% human, so understanding how such genes manifest themselves is relevant to those who share the same gene pool: There is always educational value in studying the top achievers among us, if for no other reason than to find out where we are positioned relative to the current limit of what is humanly possible (or else we wouldn't be playing and replaying videos of Cat, Jennie et al in slow-mo, and performing frame by frame comparisons with videos of our own DD, using software gimmicks).

What is most intriguing about this girl is that - based on what little we know of her so far - she does not appear to be a Usain Bolt or even a Michael Phelps (or a Cat, or a Jennie), whose physical attributes put them squarely within the "visibly privileged" end of the gene pool for their chosen field. This girl seems to be more of a Tim Lincecum, another Thunderbolt from God masquerading as a 5'10" skinny guy. At first glance, Lincecum might not appear to have the leverage of the bigger and beefier guys. However, once he is in motion, it becomes immediately obvious to anyone who pays attention that he is exceptionally limber, which, when combined with impeccable mechanics and conditioning, affords him with an extraordinary range of motion and a highly efficient means to transfer energy from one end of his body to the other, resulting in a plyometrically explosive delivery that more than compensates for whatever size disadvantage he might have had vis-a-vis the ‘normal’ sized pitchers.

I have a hunch that this girl too, is unusually flexible, and that this flexibility plays a significant part in her success, along with sound mechanics. Regardless of whether it's her genes or her technique that made her stand out, I would think that she is exactly the sort of pitcher (unexceptional size, exceptional performance) many of us who compulsively visit this board would want to have a look at? I suspect my 5’2” DD (and I) will find just as much practical inspiration, if not more, through looking at this girl’s pitching motion than through watching videos of Cat or Jennie, or those leaping hopping Japanese men.

 

[lhowser]

I wish we could see video because (here we go again) I suspect INTERNAL ROTATION has much to do with her success and speed. I have been fortunate to have a 8th grader guest pitch for me this winter and she throws HARD...very HARD. I've seen a lot of pitching and I am sure she is a legit 62. I filmed her this Saturday at 240 FPS and what I noticed was the mechanic you see by Japan's pitcher Yukiko Ueno on the slow motion clips on this site. As her arm moves down as her elbow leading is around the hip her forearm and hand externally rotate further beyond just facing third base and faces more skyward. then quickly internally rotates to release. She is probably 5'-6" and pretty long. I saw the same mechanic in a clip of a 14 year old pitching very fast for her age at compuware tourney where top players compete here in the Midwest. Same build.