Quest for pitching knowledge

[Shawn]

I don't think emphasizing the angle of the hips is the correct approach. I don't tell my students to "rotate your hips to 45 degrees. I teach them how to get a good forward stride leading with the knee, and following with the back leg not turning the back foot sideways. When you do that, the hips can't help but rotate to 45 as the front leg leads outward. Hip rotation is just something that happens, not something to focus on. It is a symptom, not a cause of good mechanics.

Correct, it’s not rotate the hips. I believe in total body, and not turning it in pieces like rotating the hips separately. I do believe in the center focus, just like martial arts focus as an energy zen approach. The coordination comes out of the center. The pelvis position is important.

 

[Fury_Mike]

This is another example of where I somewhat disagree with Rick. But in this case, I only 1/2 disagree. What I mean is, I believe in teaching kids to exaggerate a lot of the movements used in pitching. Exaggerating something like getting completely open is a great way for a kid to get used to going THROUGH the hips, and not around them per/most HE coaches. I kind of few this similar to the follow through of the pitch: quite often we can tell a lot about what was done right or wrong by the follow through. And by exaggerating the follow through, it would promote and encourage the most whip. Personally I don't know what angle or degree the hips should be, most pitchers will start to cheat the older they get. But as long as the muscle memory is in tact to go THROUGH the hips, all is fine in my book.

I think the key point that they are trying to make is regarding whether the hips should get completely open ("sideways"), and I think we all agree they should not, and Rick definitely does not teach it that way.

 

[coach james]

Th

I’m still working on going through the material again. It’s the backwards chaining instructions where the students are mostly open. If I remember correctly in lessons he really doesn’t discuss what the hips do or don’t do or their position. Take his daughter for example, very open shown at the beginning of every lesson. Tall pitcher mechanics. John Gay was tall.

I’m not trying to slander Rick or Sarah. Just looking to increase my knowledge on pitching and styles.

Rick discusses hip rotation in the elite/4D stuff.

I can watch any game on YouTube and see different styles. Oklahoma State always have lefty’s that throw very open. Good leg drive and then throw very open. Different styles.

The question is can you break the motion into two part. Rick says you can throw 90% of your total speed from the half way point. I believe what happens before that is important to what actually happens in the second half. I’m not sure anymore if backwards chaining is all that great. Ever since we started with pitching everything was taught with backwards training. Nothing new.

There are a few drills where a student will remain completely closed with her hip angles (he called it the perpendicular power line drill) this is in an attempt to create a bit more offsetting separation.
He is extremely scientific and data driven. I may have over reacted, as I'm a little defensive of him as we've gotten closer over the years.
Feel free to email me if you'd like to chat a little more in your journey
jeclark96@yahoo.com
James

 

[Shawn]

It’s not do you open. You open. It’s how you open. You may or may not close. You might close more on a curve. The hips may or may not be 45 degrees.

 

[Shawn]

You may stay more open




In Eddie Feigners book he said opening was the power source.

Stride direction effects closure.

 

[El Oso]

Look at that palm down. Ooooof, gonna make some folks head explode.

 

[Vertigo]

Look at that palm down. Ooooof, gonna make some folks head explode.




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For some reason I’ve seen quite a few IR pitchers who have their hand in this position at the same time. Interesting. My dd is one of them. I’d also say it’s probably facing 3B more than it is palm down.

 

[Fury_Mike]

Look at that palm down. Ooooof, gonna make some folks head explode.




View attachment 27673

not sure what I see in this pic. What pitch is she throwing? Change-ups are often thrown with the palm down in the downswing.

 

[El Oso]

I’d also say it’s probably facing 3B more than it is palm down.

Then you might want to visit the eye DR. You only see a small sliver of yellow. not half the ball like you would if it were facing 3b

 

[El Oso]

not sure what I see in this pic. What pitch is she throwing? Change-ups are often thrown with the palm down in the downswing.

lol did you not watch the clip? It wasn't a change up so ditch that excuse