Pitch count, pitcher protection and catchers

[RubberBiscuit]

As long as we are talking catcher pop times:

The "standard" I have seen (catcher on one of DD's SB years) was an exposure event published pop time of 1.66.

Take that for what it's worth but I will say that I went to every game that this TB-A team went to around the nation and I do not remember a single successful steal off her (counting only pitches that were caught of course). Her raw skills were a thing of beauty only to be squashed by a sh_tazz attitude.

Not sure what the BIG D1 catchers pop times are but I can't help but think they are any better than this (does somebody have data on BIG D1 pop times they can share?)

 

[Greenmonsters]

As long as we are talking catcher pop times:

The "standard" I have seen (catcher on one of DD's SB years) was an exposure event published pop time of 1.66.

Take that for what it's worth but I will say that I went to every game that this TB-A team went to around the nation and I do not remember a single successful steal off her (counting only pitches that were caught of course). Her raw skills were a thing of beauty only to be squashed by a sh_tazz attitude.

Not sure what the BIG D1 catchers pop times are but I can't help but think they are any better than this (does somebody have data on BIG D1 pop times they can share?)

More than half the catchers I've seen with very good showcase pop times would be subject to a catchers obstruction call in a real game with a swinging batter. 1.66 is extraordinary - I've never heard of a 1.5. However, I see too many catchers, including top D1 gals, setting up to throw in a runners on situation such that they decrease their blocking effectiveness.

 

[riseball]

Catchers regularly attain pop times of 1.6 - 1.8 in showcase environments for the same reason pitchers never give up a big hit or even a walk in the bullpen. Pop times are meaningless. Tell me what percent of runners attempting to steal are thrown out. Everything else is windows dressing.

 

[sbmom19]

Once again - I never intended to get into an argument about the value of pop times when I started this post. It was a question about the attention to pitcher's arms as opposed to catcher's arms.

That being said, I don't think that you can dismiss pop times as irrelevant. They are a measure of arm speed. Just like radaring a pitcher's speed is not irrelevant. Or timing a baserunner's speed out of the box to first is not irrelevant. It is merely an instrument of measurement in which to compare players. Of course situational play and how the player reacts is more important. But these baselines are important as well...

 

[BobInMadison]

Or, we could circle back to the original topic: does a faster pop time wear out the arm faster? :-O

 

[riseball]

Once again - I never intended to get into an argument about the value of pop times when I started this post. It was a question about the attention to pitcher's arms as opposed to catcher's arms.

That being said, I don't think that you can dismiss pop times as irrelevant. They are a measure of arm speed. Just like radaring a pitcher's speed is not irrelevant. Or timing a baserunner's speed out of the box to first is not irrelevant. It is merely an instrument of measurement in which to compare players. Of course situational play and how the player reacts is more important. But these baselines are important as well...

Pop time is a measure of much more than arm speed. However, arm speed or more accurately velocity only has a minimal influence on pop time.

 

[BobInMadison]

Interesting. Some of the fastest throwers did not have the best pop times. Maybe riseball is right.

 

[riseball]

Interesting. Some of the fastest throwers did not have the best pop times. Maybe riseball is right.

Don't take my word for it, just do the math with respect to time of flight and a little analysis of the results.

 

[Greenmonsters]

Here are some pop times from a college exposure camp:

http://www.delawareinvitational.org/pdf/2012_catching.pdf

I see three in the 1.5s.

And none of them average close to 1.5. Looking more closely, the OH throw velocities and the pops to 1st and 3rd suggest that the 1.5s very probably are related to operator error. FWIW, #118 is my "golden gun" winner out of all the participants.

 

[smddad]

Interesting. Some of the fastest throwers did not have the best pop times. Maybe riseball is right.

Which is what Howard Kobata teaches for his infield. A quick release is more important than higher velocity on your throws.