Fielders choice leads to stolen base. Can someone explain this play to me?

[Top_Notch]

I just happened to be watching this college game online and can't understand why the girl who ends up at second was not out. So hoping someone here can explain this to me. For the record this was D2 softball game in the South Atlantic. Even after the coach appealed the umpires ruled her safe.





I did find this rule which may apply...

12.16.3.5 The batter-runner, after overrunning first base, must immediately return nonstop to first base or, if she does not retouch first base, must make an attempt to advance to second. If after passing the base, the batter-runner is heading back toward first base within the baseline extended, she may make a decision to go to either base. However, stepping beyond the extended baseline in foul territory commits her to first base while stepping beyond the baseline toward the second-base side commits her to second base.

 

[CoachCeetar]

Can you tell if she stepped beyond the extended baseline in foul territory? I'm gonna guess not because she seemed like she knew what she was doing the whole time.

 

[ArmWhip]

A full 5 seconds goes by between the time the pitcher gets the ball from the first baseman and the runner breaks to second, that really stretches the meaning of the word 'immediately'.

 

[Jeffrey]

A full 5 seconds goes by between the time the pitcher gets the ball from the first baseman and the runner breaks to second, that really stretches the meaning of the word 'immediately'.

Agree - if she went "immediately" it would be ok, but she really stretched it. Also looked to be across the foul line which might also commit her to first. Ball is in the circle too, so might the look back rule take effect? She's strolling back to first and stops then heads to 2nd. Out?

 

[CoachCeetar]

Agree - if she went "immediately" it would be ok, but she really stretched it. Also looked to be across the foul line which might also commit her to first. Ball is in the circle too, so might the look back rule take effect? She's strolling back to first and stops then heads to 2nd. Out?

immediately doesn't specify a speed though. She's headed back. But (I don't know the specific college rules) once you've started returning to the infield and not directly to second, you've committed. By rule once she breaks for second she's out.

Unless the play by the pitcher on the runner near the end of the play negates the look-back rule? Or is it only on a _different_ runner?

 

[Jeffrey]

immediately doesn't specify a speed though. She's headed back. But (I don't know the specific college rules) once you've started returning to the infield and not directly to second, you've committed. By rule once she breaks for second she's out.

Unless the play by the pitcher on the runner near the end of the play negates the look-back rule? Or is it only on a _different_ runner?

Yes, the ball is in the circle and the runner is committed to 1st. The pitcher is just standing in the circle not faking a throw or anything. It's called the "look-back" but she doesn't actually have to "look."

 

[Cannonball]

Stopping the video, it appears that the runner was in foul territory.

 

[CoachCeetar]

Yes, the ball is in the circle and the runner is committed to 1st. The pitcher is just standing in the circle not faking a throw or anything. It's called the "look-back" but she doesn't actually have to "look."

right, but she does turn and fake a throw at the end of the video, which as I understand it makes it NOT the look-back play anymore, and if the runner wasn't called out yet (but should've been) they can't be called out now that the play is active again?

Unless it has to be a different runner? The way the NFHS rules are written, it seems like the pitcher 'attempted play' has to be on a different runner than the one in question?

Exception: The runner will not be declared out if a play is made on another runner (a fake throw is considered a play).

But that's just chaos right? Take this play, the second the pitcher turns, a runner planted at third regains the option to try to advance, and if she does so, the second the pitcher turns to address that, the first runner would become safe. The runner at third, once the pitcher stops faking the throw, and has the ball in the circle still, regains the choice of returning to third or continuing on.

 

[Top_Notch]

Like I said, I was watching this online so what I saw is what you see. The coach did confer with the umpires but the ultimate ruling was the runner was safe. I thought for sure the safe call would be overturned but it wasn't. The coach accepted it and they moved on. MAYBE the pitcher was standing outside the back of the circle? I don't know. I certainly didn't understand the play.

 

[ArmWhip]

I went to a D1 game today and saw exactly the same play, and a no call. Attempted double play that was unsuccessful and as the runner was slowly returning to first she bolted for second. With the ball in 8 ft circle everyone relaxes and stops watching the runner. Teams will adjust as this play becomes more widespread.