Sore or Injury?

[ThundersDad]

Hey Hal, or any of you experienced pitchers or teachers. My DD has been pitching for three summers of travel ball, this summer is her fourth season. She is 13, and has never had any shoulder pain that she has told me about. Last week on Monday we pitched at home, then went back out on Wednesday to work some and after warming up overhand and underhand, after the first hard throw she said that her shoulder popped and was sore, so we didn't pitch anymore. We pitched on Friday, thirty pitches or so, and nothing hurt at all. Saturday we played in a one day tournament and the first game she pitched that morning ( 5 innings ) she did fine. I did think that her velocity was off some though. That afternoon around 5:00 she pitched again for 3 innings and she said her shoulder hurt when she threw hard. We changed pitchers, we have three. Hal, her shoulder is not sore, not swelled, she only says it hurts in one tiny spot on top when she goes around fast or hard. Yesterday and today she says she is fine, although we are not throwing. Just wanted some thoughts on what this sounds like.

 

[sluggers]

Where is the shoulder pain? If it is the front of the shoulder, she likely pulled one of the two bicep tendons that connect the bicep to the shoulder. A 2009 study of softball pitchers found that these tendons are the ones that are stressed during underhand pitching.

Here is a link giving some general discussion regarding bicep tendinitis: Shoulder Tendonitis/bicep-tendonitis.html

Symptoms include:

* Pain when the arm is overhead or bent.
* Localized tenderness as the tendon passes over the groove in the upper arm bone.
* Occasionally, a snapping sound or sensation in the shoulder area.

That is my bet...but, she should see a doctor.

As an aside, don't over-react to it. It is very important that your DD stay honest with you about her injuries, so you have to be low key and matter-of-fact about it.

 

[Amy in AZ.]

My DD had that and hers was called a impingement. It only showed up on an MRI.

I'm not saying that is what she has, just throwing a term out for you.

 

[ThundersDad]

Thanks Sluggers, The spot is on top or just slightly in front of on top. She says she has no pain or discomfort when she bends or lifts her arm. I just know that she backed off throwing hard in the last game on Saturday. She did admit to me that it hurt a little bit. I appreciate your knowledge and advice to us. My wife works for our local hospital in home health, so she sees physical therapist every day. I just wanted some opinions from some of you, because not all doctors or therapist are familiar with our sport. We will see a doctor and therapist if necessary, according to what the doctor tells us. I just hope she doesn't have any serious problems. Thank You Again Sluggers for your reply.

 

[halskinner]

1. If it persists, see a doctor.

2. Have her make a muscle, bend the elbow to 90 degrees, do the Popeye thing. Does that hurt anywhere?

3. Keep making the Popeye muscle but now slowly go past 90 degrees and bring the fist to the shoulder. Does that hurt at any point on either the top of the bicep muscle or near the top / front of the shoulder??

If it hurts at the top of the bicep muscle, chances are there is a stretched ligamate. I highly doubt it with what you are describing.

If it hurts at the shoulder when doing that, there is a chance the ligamate is enflamed. It sounds like there is a chance that may be the culprit.

An experienced PT can run her through a few simple exercises and pinpoint what is buggin her.

 

[ThundersDad]

Thank You So Much Mr. Hal, Your knowledge from experience really helps us. By the way, we bought your book and we think that it is awesome. We are using some different delivery times and methods with her. The quick pitch, where she comes together and then just steps and throws is awesome, the batters just stand there and look, probably thinking where did her swingback go, where did that pitch come from? It really does work, just like you said. She also throws the slingshot, and most of the time the batters just stand and watch it being called for a strike too. You are right on Mr. Hal about keeping the batters timing off with different deliveries. Thanks Again, Thunder and Her Dad!

 

[halskinner]

Glad she liked them. But, remember, don't laugh at the batters. It's like,,, REALLY rude. Tell her ole coach Hal is proud of her.

Believe it or not;

At a funeral a few months ago, I ran into a couple of the guys from my dad's old team from the 60's and 70'. They both live in the same town I used to teach in when I hung up my glove 4 years ago.

They told me that so many of the young pitchers were using my tactics that they actually banned a few of my tactics in that city's league. I asked them why and they just said "Because NOBODY was hitting the ball at all".

Well, watchya gonna do??

 

[RobD]

My daughter is 14, started pitching some last year,,, didnt do any over the fall and winter and then started this spring. We have been doing more this year. Last week she said in her upper arm near the shoulder it felt like a popping sensation and hurt, but then it would go away and there was no pain. After pitching Thursday night it popped a bunch in that game and hurt some, then she had some volleyball practice after the game. Today she says if she does what you say in numbers 2 and 3....it hurts more on top of the shoulder than in front. Her next game would be next Tuesday. I was going to have her practice pitching this weekend, but now I wont do it. What is better for this, putting heat or cold on it?

Also, a woman from a local Sport & Spine clinic is the trainer for our school, so I will probably give her a call and see if she can check it out. Since she see this stuff for her work, I am hoping we can get some rehab going and get this taken care of.

Rob

1. If it persists, see a doctor.

2. Have her make a muscle, bend the elbow to 90 degrees, do the Popeye thing. Does that hurt anywhere?

3. Keep making the Popeye muscle but now slowly go past 90 degrees and bring the fist to the shoulder. Does that hurt at any point on either the top of the bicep muscle or near the top / front of the shoulder??

If it hurts at the top of the bicep muscle, chances are there is a stretched ligamate. I highly doubt it with what you are describing.

If it hurts at the shoulder when doing that, there is a chance the ligamate is enflamed. It sounds like there is a chance that may be the culprit.

An experienced PT can run her through a few simple exercises and pinpoint what is buggin her.

 

[RobD]

Just to add to my previous post, I just talked to my daughter and she said the popping feeling and pain was on the outside of the shoulder near the top and is a little sore if she pushes on it now. Also with her arm raised and bent, like when your making a muscle, it hurts kind of on the backside of the shoulder closer to the top. She will be resting it for now, and we will see what our schools sports trainer says. I just have her take ibuprofen now for the inflamation and minor pain, and use a gel cold pack on it off and on through the day. Any other ideas, please do let me know. The 3 hours of volleyball after pitching the other night I am sure was not good for it either, as she said she was setting the ball almost the entire time, and that has her working her arms up and over her head.

Rob

 

[Amy in AZ.]

"The 3 hours of volleyball after pitching the other night I am sure was not good for it either, as she said she was setting the ball almost the entire time, and that has her working her arms up and over her head."

There you go. That would be too much for anyone and her shoulder is telling her so.