Shoving a player off a base-

[obbay]

I had two issues at 3B recently which I did not see but found out about after.

1) U14- 3B is straddling the bag, not in the runners way, awaiting the oncoming throw. Runner deliberately shoves 3B who misses the throw and ball goes into OF, runner scores.

2) U18 - Pop fly is caught, throw to 3B to pick off runner, but runner is back ion time. 3B pushes runner off the bag with ball in glove, Blue calls runner out.

In both scenarios, outcome of game was not affected (shoving teams lost).

 

[Comp]

1) If F5 is straddling the bag, how is she not in the way of the runner if not in posession of the ball? Sounds like obstruction to me but would have to see the play. Even if it is obstruction, does not give the offensive player the right to purposely shove the defensive player.

2) Did F5 push the runner off the base, or was the runner off balance in returning to the base and in the normal course of applying a tag the runner fell off the base? If the runner was pushed off the base Ive got a dead ball, put the runner back on base. If the runner fell off the base with the application of a normal tag I have an out.

 

[bucket pinata]

When my DD plays third and the runner comes in and is two lazy to slide on a close play, If the ball get there in time she will catch the ball and sweep through the momentum of the runner, apply the tag chest high and try to sweep her off the bag while keeping her mitt on the runner. get 3-5 outs a season that way. Great heads up play as far as Im concerned.

 

[obbay]

1) F5 had one foot foul and one foot on the OF side behind the base, receiving throw from right side of IF. runner had a clear lane to the bag if she slid- she didn't slide so that's probably how the 3B got shoved. Runner taking the turn would have been clear if she stepped on the edge of the bag but stepping on the middle of the bag enabled the collision. Could have been accidental, but to hear the 3B tell it sounded like a cheap shot. it also sounds like on any close play at 3B the runner can feel free to collide with or shove F5 as long as F5 is near the base and doesn't have the ball - true?

2) F5 took the ball in glove and with two hands pushed the BR off the base. not sure where 3B coach was looking at the time. This was deliberate and not a smooth play.

 

[Comp]

1) F5 had one foot foul and one foot on the OF side behind the base, receiving throw from right side of IF. runner had a clear lane to the bag if she slid- she didn't slide so that's probably how the 3B got shoved. Runner taking the turn would have been clear if she stepped on the edge of the bag but stepping on the middle of the bag enabled the collision. Could have been accidental, but to hear the 3B tell it sounded like a cheap shot. it also sounds like on any close play at 3B the runner can feel free to collide with or shove F5 as long as F5 is near the base and doesn't have the ball - true?

2) F5 took the ball in glove and with two hands pushed the BR off the base. not sure where 3B coach was looking at the time. This was deliberate and not a smooth play.

In 1 it sounds like F5 had poor positioning for a throw from the right side of IF, that would put the runner between them and the ball coming in. There is no requirement to slide, so having a clear path if the runner slid only makes it sound more like obstruction by F5 to me. But, because a runner is obstructed does not give them the right to plow a defender. Without seeing it in person its impossible to say if it was just a collision because F5 was in the wrong spot, or if the runner purposely plowed into F5.

In 2, if F5 took both hands and pushed the runner off the base I have a dead ball, put the runner back and issue a warning to F5.

 

[Umpire]

1) F5 had one foot foul and one foot on the OF side behind the base, receiving throw from right side of IF. runner had a clear lane to the bag if she slid- she didn't slide so that's probably how the 3B got shoved. Runner taking the turn would have been clear if she stepped on the edge of the bag but stepping on the middle of the bag enabled the collision. Could have been accidental, but to hear the 3B tell it sounded like a cheap shot. it also sounds like on any close play at 3B the runner can feel free to collide with or shove F5 as long as F5 is near the base and doesn't have the ball - true?

The solution is to tell the fielder to get out of the way. It isn't up to the fielder, coach or father to determine which portion of the base the runner is entitled to. Just be lucky the runner didn't step on her with metal cleats, which is what I would have done. That tends to solve the issue and that's why MLB players get out of the way - they know better!

 

[cmustangsfp]

We had a girl that would put firm pressure on the runner once they got to the bag. She never extended her arms and pushed, but held the glove/ball firmly against their body for a few seconds. Sometimes the girls would lose their balance and be called out. I instructed her that she could continue with her firm pressure but NOT to push the runner and she obeyed. Her firm pressure was OK in my book.

 

[coach james]

When my DD plays third and the runner comes in and is two lazy to slide on a close play, If the ball get there in time she will catch the ball and sweep through the momentum of the runner, apply the tag chest high and try to sweep her off the bag while keeping her mitt on the runner. get 3-5 outs a season that way. Great heads up play as far as Im concerned.

Love it.... I'm a big fan of holding a tag on the runner as long as possible, but not shoving. I can't count the number of times I've seen kids stand up off the bag after sliding in safely, only to be called out because they failed to call time before getting up, if the tag is still applied when this happens.... hit the bench kiddo

 

[RubberBiscuit]

I remember 2008 LL regional’s again here where a Kentucky catcher laid on top of a runner who was trying to score from third. The catcher honestly laid on top of the runner for what must have been almost 10 seconds waiting for her pitcher to come rescue the ball that had dribbled away from her on the throw. The plate umpire there was standing there like he was refereeing a professional wrestling event (and he was!). In the end the smaller runner eventually got free from the mugger from Kentucky and scored but holy cow what was the blue thinking during this?... The Kentucky team eventually inspired a very unfortunate calling of the police to the fields when they got out of hand at another time during the event. Towards the end of that event I believe all the rest of the state teams were about ready to take them out behind the ally….

It was funny as Kentucky put forward the most obnoxious team in 2008 only to be followed by the classiest team in 2009.