We're allowed to sit outside the dugout here, but just outside the doorway. Not behind the batter's box...
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- Jun 10, 2010
- 7
- 0
Same here.
Yup, it's in the rulebook somewhere. It's just not quite as simple as he made it sound.
In ASA:
Definitions: Blocked ball - a batted, pitched, or thrown ball that is touched, stopped or handled by a person not engaged in the game, or which touches loose equipment or any object that is not part of the official equipment or official playing area.
Effects:
8-5-C. When a pitched ball that remains live becomes blocked or goes out of live ball territory. EFFECT: The ball is dead and runners are awarded one base only. The batter is awarded first base only on the fourth ball.
8-5-G. When the ball is live and is overthrown or is blocked.
EFFECT: All runners should be awarded two bases. The award shall be governed by the position of the runners when the ball left the fielder's hand. Runners must return to touch a base missed or a base left too soon. When two runners are between the same two bases, the award is based on the position of the lead runner. [snip]
Exceptions:
[snip]
3. If the ball becomes blocked due to offensive equipment not involved in the game.
EFFECT - the ball is dead and runners are returned to the last base touched at the time of the blocked ball. If the blocked ball prevented the defense from making an out, the runner being played on is out.
In essence, if the defense caused the ball to be blocked, it is one base on a pitch, two bases on a thrown ball from the time of the throw. The coach being out of the dugout and being hit by the ball, or the ball hitting the bucket, would be an example.
If the offense caused the ball to be blocked, the runners are returned to the base last touched. An example would be the on-deck batter dropping her bat and the ball hits it.
dytakeda, this should not happen in travel ball if the umpire is on top of things.
5-12: Dugout conduct.
Coaches, players, substitutes, and other bench personnel shall not be outside the designated bench, dugout/team area except when the rule allows or is justified by the umpire.
"When the rule allows" includes being a base coach, conferences, etc. I guess "justified by the umpire" is up for interpretation. To me, "justified" by the umpire is not the same as "allowed." A coach comes onto the field to talk with me about a call or to give line-up changes, I can justify his presence. I can't justify his being out of the dugout to give his catcher signals, especially if it can cause a dead ball situation.
Thanks for the insight everyone. I did think it a little odd where he was, because I could see his signs from the first base coaches box. I didn't try and figure them out, because again at our level, the batters are still just trying to react, as opposed to think along with the pitcher. It did cause a some consternation among some of the parents, because for about half the team, it was the 13th game they've ever played, against a pitcher with some obvious experience and an adult calling her pitches. I didn't make a fuss about it because he could have just moved to the dugout opening, which was even with third base.
I try to remain as inconspicuous as possible. It sounds like this coach wanted the game to be about him.
The giving signs part for the original post to the catcher is common. I'm not sure of how your field setup is but I guess if the ump says its OK, then its OK. As a coach, I try very hard to not make it obvious I'm giving signs though and usually do it from behind the fence inside the dugout.
redhotcoach
Out on good behavior
- May 8, 2009
- 4,698
- 38
I would say I have come across about 1 in 10 umps that tell us to stay in the dugout. I had one game that really ticked me off....opposing coach was an extreme loud mouth and paced around like a meth addict. At times he would be within about 10 feet of the batters box and be howlering at his defense while my girls were being pitched to. It took 3 protests to blue from me (2 being nice, third I finally said so everyone at the field could hear "blue, he is really distracting our batters!") before he was told to stay in the dugout.
Once we have finished the pre-game meeting at home plate, or during the period between each half inning; unless a coach has requested time (and has been granted time by the umpire) for purposes of an offensive conference, defensive conference, to make a lineup change, to attend to an injured player, to question or get clarification on a call/ruling or tournament rule/procedure, to question an opposing team's substitution or batting order, OR if they are one of the two coaches allowed by rule to be in the 1B or 3B coach's box when their team is batting.....COACHES BELONG IN THE DUGOUT....period.
The ONLY exception to this would be if there were a tournament rule allowing them a specific area outside the dugout where they could sit/stand; and I have worked tournaments that do allow this.
I can't speak for every rule set, but for those that I work (NCAA, NFHS, ASA, PONY) there is no language in their rule books that permit coaches to be anywhere else but the dugout. I have yet to find the rule that states, "coaches are allowed to sit on a bucket or stand outside the dugout."
The best field I ever worked at had designed their bench areas in such a manner that the concrete extended about 3 ft. beyond the protective fence of the dugout (picture it as a sidewalk), this was considered part of the bench area, and as such, a dead ball area. Coaches could sit in their buckets and do their thing...legally.
THE TOP 10 RESPONSES I'VE GOTTEN WHEN I'VE TOLD COACHES THAT THEY HAVE TO BE IN THE DUGOUT
10) What do you mean I can't sit on a bucket out here?
9) How is my catcher suppose to see me if I'm not out here?
8) My pitcher won't be able to see me if I'm not out there.
7) I've been coaching (fill in the blank) years and I've always sat out here on a bucket.
6) I've got the scorebook, so I have to be able to see.
5) I'm keeping the pitch chart, I have to see where the pitches are.
4) I'm reporting you to... (fill in the blank).
3) The umps who worked our last game let me sit here.
2) It's too hot in there
And the best one...
1) Blue, you gotta give a break, it's our fourth game today and the girls are driving me crazy, I promise you i won't say boo....I'm begging you blue.
The ONLY exception to this would be if there were a tournament rule allowing them a specific area outside the dugout where they could sit/stand; and I have worked tournaments that do allow this.
I can't speak for every rule set, but for those that I work (NCAA, NFHS, ASA, PONY) there is no language in their rule books that permit coaches to be anywhere else but the dugout. I have yet to find the rule that states, "coaches are allowed to sit on a bucket or stand outside the dugout."
The best field I ever worked at had designed their bench areas in such a manner that the concrete extended about 3 ft. beyond the protective fence of the dugout (picture it as a sidewalk), this was considered part of the bench area, and as such, a dead ball area. Coaches could sit in their buckets and do their thing...legally.
THE TOP 10 RESPONSES I'VE GOTTEN WHEN I'VE TOLD COACHES THAT THEY HAVE TO BE IN THE DUGOUT
10) What do you mean I can't sit on a bucket out here?
9) How is my catcher suppose to see me if I'm not out here?
8) My pitcher won't be able to see me if I'm not out there.
7) I've been coaching (fill in the blank) years and I've always sat out here on a bucket.
6) I've got the scorebook, so I have to be able to see.
5) I'm keeping the pitch chart, I have to see where the pitches are.
4) I'm reporting you to... (fill in the blank).
3) The umps who worked our last game let me sit here.
2) It's too hot in there
And the best one...
1) Blue, you gotta give a break, it's our fourth game today and the girls are driving me crazy, I promise you i won't say boo....I'm begging you blue.
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