Player of The Year award

[_MIA_]

The argument about her not playing defense is a good one, but Alo shattered the D1 home run record and was at or near the top in other key offensive categories. Hard to see how you don’t recognize that.

I think you hit it on the head..it was more of a career recognition sort of thing then anything else..

 

[_MIA_]

ETA: Alo’s HR total almost certainly would have even been higher if teams had actually pitched to her over those two or three weeks that she was closing in on the HR record.

This is true. I don't think anybody is going to argue with you if you say she is the best hitter in college softball. Not pitching to her was pretty weak IMO, especially when teams were doing it when they were losing by 10 runs..Nobody is going to remember which team she broke the record against.

 

[LEsoftballdad]

Jennings has 52 HR already through two seasons, so it's possible she catches Alo. Also, she had 24 games in 2020 that count towards her totals. Alo, Jennings, and Chamberlain all homer at about the same pace. The difference is Alo had 150+ more ABs than Chamberlain. That's a similar situation to the whole Ruth/Aaron argument. It took Aaron almost 4,000 more ABs to match Ruth's total.

Look, she's a phenomenal hitter, no one can argue that. I just don't know if you can give her POY.

@pattar , yes, Barnard had more HR this season in four fewer games. I don't know how many times she was walked, though.

@Orange Socks has the right idea. Split the award in three.

 

[Nimrod]

Who had the better year, Ruth or Gehrig?

The argument in MLB is they should have two awards, POY and MVP. How can Andre Dawson win the award on a losing team? Would his team be worse without him? Should he have gotten a player of the year award while someone who took their team to the playoffs got MVP? The same applies here. Without Alo, would OU have been a .500 team? I don't think so.

I've never liked that particular interpretation of 'most valuable,' although it's commonly applied. Oklahoma probably wins the national title without any single current player, so that would arguably eliminate all of them on that basis. To give a baseball example, Freddie Freeman was hugely ''valuable'' to the Braves in that they don't get in the playoffs without him last year. So he has to be high in MVP voting. But if the Braves had been in the NL West, they wouldn't have made the playoffs at all. So Freeman's value is largely determined by what division he plays in.

I'd rather MVP be the best player, period. What's the player's value on the open market? What would Alo's individual performance bring to any team? Would you rather have a designated hitter with a 2.000 OPS (Alo), or a shortstop with good glove & speed whose OPS is 1.400 (Grace Lyons)? Lyons is a heckuva hitter too, but that's still a huge gap between 2.000 and 1.400. The all-around player is attractive, but consider how valuable it is to erase your worst hitter in the lineup with Jocelyn Alo. Even at Oklahoma, she erases maybe a .900 OPS hitter. On the average team, that might be a .600 OPS hitter. Not lobbying for Alo, just pointing out how valuable a single hitter is with DH rules. Ironically, she's more valuable sitting on defense. The DH rule eliminates her weakness (fielding).

 

[_MIA_]

I'd rather MVP be the best player, period. What's the player's value on the open market? What would Alo's individual performance bring to any team? Would you rather have a designated hitter with a 2.000 OPS (Alo), or a shortstop with good glove & speed whose OPS is 1.400 (Grace Lyons)? Lyons is a heckuva hitter too, but that's still a huge gap between 2.000 and 1.400. The all-around player is attractive, but consider how valuable it is to erase your worst hitter in the lineup with Jocelyn Alo. Even at Oklahoma, she erases maybe a .900 OPS hitter. On the average team, that might be a .600 OPS hitter. Not lobbying for Alo, just pointing out how valuable a single hitter is with DH rules. Ironically, she's more valuable sitting on defense. The DH rule eliminates her weakness (fielding).

Typically you would think about this by replacing Alo with an “average” player (and usually “league” average so .900 would be quite high) but good points.

Somebody should do WAR for fastpitch

 

[CoachJD]

I just looked it up and saw that no MLB player has ever won the MVP award as a DH. I tend to agree that an EH shouldn't win the award because they don't play both ways.

A number of AL pitchers have won MVP though, so it's the same thing re: one-way players.

Heck, Dennis Eckersley won MVP as a closer. That's like a half-way player.

 

[radness]

What would happen if the biggest hitter like Alo were walked every time.

And
Considering the rules and how many pinch-runner player could have eventually they would have to run for them self or be pulled

The entire lineup of consistent hitters is something to consider Beyond the one that can be worked around.

 

[_MIA_]

What would happen if the biggest hitters & Alo were walked every time.

And
Considering the rules and how many pinch-runner player could have eventually they would have to run for them self or be pulled

The entire lineup of consistent hitters is something to consider Beyond the one that can be worked around.

For OU it probably wouldn't mean much (in the regular season at least) because of your last sentence.

 

[radness]

For OU it probably wouldn't mean much (in the regular season at least) because of your last sentence.

Yes I would consider the productivity /pressure of
'the rest of the lineup/roster' who played both offense and defense for awards because they are the ones
that put that predicament on the offense to walk batters like Alo.

One batter in of themself is only one batter, it is the lineup that creates the predicament.

 

[_MIA_]

Yes I would consider the pressure of
'the rest of the lineup/roster' who played both offense and defense for awards because they are the ones
that put that predicament on the offense to walk batters like Alo.

One batter in of themself is only one batter, it is the lineup that creates the predicament.

That said Alo still walked almost once per game (49 in 56 games)