Pictures of pitchers feet

[MTR]

Well, whatever. I personally think if they are going to call that on an 11 year old, they should probably put lanes somewhere!

Why, who is going to see them? Even in the NCAA it was noted that the lines they put down were for the pitcher's reference.

Again, they've been there for years, why is it all of a sudden a problem?

 

[MTR]

An official ASA interpretation, published on their website May 2012:

For the past few months or so we have been asked about a pitching style called a “Push, Drag, Push” or a “Crow Drag in Women’s and Junior Olympic Fast Pitch. This is described as a pitcher that pushes from the pitcher’s plate, drags her pivot foot, stops and pushes again. We have been told that there are some indicators like a bent leg or the pivot foot bearing weight as a factor in this style of pitching. We have looked at several videos and several pitchers. We disagree that any of these pitchers are pushing, dragging, stopping and pushing again. We can see what appears to be a pivot by the pivot foot at the end of their delivery but not a re-push.

Nowhere in the ASA rules does it state anything illegal about the pivot foot bearing weight or the leg being bent. As long as the pivot foot starts on the pitcher's plate and pushes away, remains on the ground within the 24-inch width of the pitcher's plate and the arm continues without stopping in the delivery, it is a legal pitch. The pitcher opening her hips causes the foot to turn (pivot mark in the dirt) and then with pivot foot remaining on the ground (drag mark), the pitcher then closes her hips which produces another pivot mark in the dirt. This is not an illegal pitch by ASA pitching rules. We would also add, it is not possible to push, drag, stop and re-push while the non-pivot foot is in the air. It is possible to re-push if you leap and land.

I've thought of this as an excuse issued in dummying down the violation. They simply address tips that umpires have used as an indicator and state what is seen in these tips isn't illegal. What is stated as "impossible" is, IMO, not impossible.

 

[RubberBiscuit]

An official ASA interpretation, published on their website May 2012:

We would also add, it is not possible to push, drag, stop and re-push while the non-pivot foot is in the air.

ASA brains - are you kidding me? You guys are next going to sell me on a flat earth. Wow, you guys can be politicians at any time. Way to show your inability to think your way out of a wet paper bag.......

 

[cuzmail]

No, it's been years, she was still at Texas. Even one of the talking heads on ESPN hesitated when they showed her delivery in slow motion. I was shocked when I first saw it, because it seemed very unlikely. For as much as I know, it may not have even been intentional, but with the direction of the spray, I don't think there was much doubt that the toe was getting a second push

That makes sense. All of our interactions with her have been after the UT days.

Also, watching a lot of slow mo video you will notice that most pitchers elevate their pivot foot some above the plane of the ground at the same time as leaving the PP and it usually looks perfect on real time.

 

[cuzmail]

No, it's been years, she was still at Texas. Even one of the talking heads on ESPN hesitated when they showed her delivery in slow motion. I was shocked when I first saw it, because it seemed very unlikely. For as much as I know, it may not have even been intentional, but with the direction of the spray, I don't think there was much doubt that the toe was getting a second push

That makes sense. All of our interactions with her have been after the UT days.

Also, watching a lot of slow mo video you will notice that most pitchers elevate their pivot foot some above the plane of the ground at the same time as leaving the PP and it usually looks perfect in real time.

 

[BretMan]

ASA brains - are you kidding me? You guys are next going to sell me on a flat earth. Wow, you guys can be politicians at any time. Way to show your inability to think your way out of a wet paper bag.......

Way to resort to lame insults when presented with a view that conflicts with your narrow-minded opinion.

And much of what I see here is just that. Opinion. How is it that people who have never attended an umpiring class or clinic, made a study of the rules and their interpretations or, for that matter, ever umpired a ballgame in their lives are such experts on the pitching rules?

But none of that matters. They know what they know, don't know what they don't know and refuse to accept anything that doesn't jibe with that. When presented with official interpretations, they say that they aren't right, or they don't mean what they say, or that they're stupid.

Way to stay open-minded.

 

[JDBerry]

Way to stay open-minded.

careful with all that hypocrisy

 

[JDBerry]

What is stated as "impossible" is, IMO, not impossible.

of course it's not impossible. It's a ludicrous point to make and is completely ambiguous to the rule definition, which basically removes credibility to the whole interpretation and those who support it.

"A crow hop is defined as the act of a pitcher who steps, hops, or drags off the
Front of the pitcher's plate, replants the pivot foot, establishing a second impetus
(or starting point), pushes off from the newly-established starting point and
and completes the delivery."

 

[MTR]

careful with all that hypocrisy

Let me see......a guy gets slammed for providing documentation of an interpretation from what many consider a viable source and you think it is hypocritical for him to mention being open minded?

You are aware that unlike many, if not most, on this and other boards, Bretman actually attends and takes from multiple clinics and schools every year and not just ASA. BTW, those interpretations are not just pulled out of somebody's rear, but compiled after discussions with umpire officials from around North America and multiple organizations.

ASA may be the premier dictatorial good ol' boys club when it comes to the administration of the NGB, but when it comes to the rules of the game, it is closer to democratic than anything you will see in this country. They may not always get it right the first time, but the rules constantly change, and much more than most people notice.

 

[RubberBiscuit]

Way to resort to lame insults when presented with a view that conflicts with your narrow-minded opinion.

And much of what I see here is just that. Opinion. How is it that people who have never attended an umpiring class or clinic, made a study of the rules and their interpretations or, for that matter, ever umpired a ballgame in their lives are such experts on the pitching rules?

But none of that matters. They know what they know, don't know what they don't know and refuse to accept anything that doesn't jibe with that. When presented with official interpretations, they say that they aren't right, or they don't mean what they say, or that they're stupid.

Way to stay open-minded.

BM - what is your response mode when you read or see something completely ridiculous about something you are passionate about? Are you telling me you just "take it", bite your tongue, and walk away?

I am fed up with folks not able to accept passionate opinions. And yes i agree with you that this is my OPINION.

You
folks that cant handle a little passionate exchange of ideas either go find yourself a group full of "yes-men" and "i agree with everyone" drones or just exclude me from your little lovefest.

Oh and note that i have been umping for quite many years.