Glove vs. Mitt

[Gbucz]

Rules state mitts can only be used by catchers and 1B. The reason is this - a few years back we were in an ASA tourney and noticed 1B and 2B both had 1B mitts on (same model). We brought the question to the coach as courtesy that the 2B should use a fielders glove. Ump overheard and noticed then threw the girl out of the tourney for illegal equipment!! We apologized profusely as that was not our intent but ump was cut and dry here.

Now we come to fall ball NSA tourney this year in championship game against a team with a real jerk of a coach. I notice the pitcher playing with a 1B mitt. She is better than their other pitcher who we bombed earlier in the tourney, so I let our coach know of my experience before. He raises the point to ump and is shot down that it is not a rule. We pullout the NSA book and it says in sec 3 rule 3 "...Only the catcher and first baseman may wear mitts." Other coach (jerk) says 'where does the rule define mitt or glove?' - we cannot find it so ump sides with the jerk!

BTW we lost 4-2 but there were 2 on when we made the appeal so they would be awarded 3 bases for illegal glove and glove removed per penalty in NSA rules.

What is the deal?

 

[Amy in AZ.]

It is no longer a rule in ASA. I lose track of time, but someone can tell us how long it has been allowed in ASA. 5 years, maybe. I don't know about NSA.

 

[Comp]

Hasnt been a rule in ASA for at least 6 years that I know of. Also not a rule in FED, TCS or USSSA. NSA appears to be the only one I can find that limits a mitt to only catcher and 1st.

Also, not only is it not a rule in ASA, the penalty is not an ejection even if it was an illegal glove. As for the coach who was arguing there was no definition in the book of glove vs mitt, anyone who has been involved in baseball/softball knows a glove has fingers, a mitt does not.

 

[BretMan]

Really strange...you had an ASA umpire enforcing the NSA rule (with a bogus penalty added in for fun) and an NSA umpire enforcing the ASA rule (yet was ignorant of the difference between a glove and a mitt).

BTW...the three-base award for using an illegal glove applies only if said glove is actually used in making a play, and then the penalty may only be applied if the glove is discovered/protested before the next pitch. If the glove is discovered before a play is made, it can simply be removed without penalty.

The first rule set I can remember that allowed either a glove or mitt to be worn at any position was NFHS (high school). High school softball and baseball both have allowed a mitt at any position since at least the late-90's (when I first began umpiring that sanction). I believe that their baseball rules are unique in that they are the only sanction to allow this.

Before that, softball rules borrowed the same guidelines that had been in place in baseball for nearly a hundred years- mitts for catchers and first basemen only. The use of a mitt was deemed to provide an advantage to fielders that the game didn't intend, so their use was limited. Not really surprising for a game that was originally played bare-handed and had to go through a major evolution before it accepted even the most rudimetary of gloves.

ASA followed suit and changed their rule in (I believe) 2006. Today you have kind of a mish-mash of rules depending on the sanctioning body. Some allow gloves and mitts at any position, others don't.

And it gets even more confusing than that. For example, NSA fastpitch softball does not allow a mitt at any position. However NSA slowpitch rules do. USSSA is just the opposite! In fastpitch anybody can wear a mitt, but in slowpitch only F2 and F3 are allowed to.

It's no wonder people get confused over this rule. That's why it always pays to be familiar with the particular rules for whichever sanctioning body you happen to be playing under that day...and that goes double for the umpires!

 

[MTR]

Bretman is correct. Beginning with the 2006 season, any player could wear a legal glove or mitt at any position in ASA

 

[GOINGDEEP]

Wooooooooo, by the title I thought this was a political thread.

 

[ConorMacleod]

My question is, at what point did you notice the pitcher wearing a mitt? And did you notify the Umpire immediately, or did you wait until you got two runners on hoping that it would get you a cheap run or two? I'm all for playing fair, but in my book fair means not waiting to point out violations until the rules would benefit you the most (if that is what happened). Just like when coaches decide to slow the game down when they are ahead with a time limit approaching.

 

[Gbucz]

My question is, at what point did you notice the pitcher wearing a mitt? .

I am not coaching this team but as a parent I noticed it in the 2nd inning. By the time I explained the situation I had been through and got the coaches to appeal we had two on.

And did you notify the Umpire immediately, or did you wait until you got two runners on hoping that it would get you a cheap run or two? I'm all for playing fair, but in my book fair means not waiting to point out violations until the rules would benefit you the most (if that is what happened).

The opposing coach is a known jerk and would certainly go for the cheap runs and the throw out.

 

[Gbucz]

Wooooooooo, by the title I thought this was a political thread.

Didn't even notice until you brought it up