cut-throat travel teams

[PA SB Dad]

I may be in the minority, but I let my players know they have a spot on the team the next year if they wish to come back to me. I only coach 14U, so I have kids age out every year, and the younger players can decide whether they stay or go. It helps to have players who have played with me for a year to help the new players understand how things run on the team. They have to let me know before tryouts begin. If they tryout for other teams, they are in the same mix with the new players at that point. I try to be loyal to the kids who played for me and helped to develop. I've only cut one player in the last few years and that was for lack of effort. If they move on to a better team or a better fit, that is fine, but they have to understand it is a two-way street. Commit to play for me (with a deposit) or take your chances at tryouts. I hate this time of year, so if I can have a good roster without going through tryouts, all the better.

 

[vdubya]

Should a team with returning players look to "churn" the bottom 1/4 of their roster, year over year?

Most certainly do whether the team is cut throat by your definition or not. Quite often, the lower rungs churn themselves to a different team where they can get more playing time. Other times the team churns them. The churning is generally healthy for all involved, regardless of who initiated it.

 

[FP26]

We are entering tryout season in my region right now, so a lot of these posts hit home with me.

IMO, the coaches in my area can be separated into two groups; Those who coach players and those who recruit players. There are a few that can do some of both, but generally it is one or the other. Either they do the best they can to teach the players on the roster, or they spend most of their time on the phone recruiting players weeks before their current season is over. From my experience most of the latter do so because they have no idea how to teach the players. We have one organization in particular in our area. The coach has called a friend of mine 6 times now. Each time she has told the coach "no", but he doesn't seem to get the message. The same coach was a spectator at a recent tournament and was trying to recruit players between games right in front of their current coaches. I realize this is part of travel ball, but it is a part that I would rather not participate in. Just seems slimy to me...

 

[grcsftbll]

A travel ball season is like a one year contract. Once the season is over, everyone is a free agent and the players have no obligation to that team and the coaches have no obligation to any player. Once the season ends, all roster spots are open. That's how I've always viewed it because that's how it was explained to me 6 seasons ago when my dd tried out for her first travel ball team.

I like this approach. I feel like travel ball is expensive and time consuming, and considering it's youth athletics it's pretty darn serious. I want my daughter to have a shot at the position she wants if we try out for a new team. And I don't mind her feeling a little competitive drive to keep her position if she's sticking with a team. I think she's going to have some good competition for both her positions on our new team and I think it's great. I have already seen her up her aggression in going after the ball at short stop, and we're not even officially practicing yet. On her old team she was top dog; it'll be good for her to have to work harder to play the roles she wants to play. If it turns out the other girls are better and she gets bumped to a different position, she'll learn to deal with that gracefully (I hope), and to work hard to get another shot down the road. These life lessons are, IMO, one of the most awesome things about having kids who play sports.

I've had to have this conversation with my older daughter recently. She plays baseball, rec. She mostly plays outfield, occasionally 2nd base. She's got great hand eye coordination and can be super fast but she just looks apathetic on the field. She doesn't hustle out, she doesn't charge the ball. Then she complains about playing outfield. Sorry, kid. If I'm your coach, I'm giving the kids who have the desire the infield positions. Hustle, give it your all, be excited to be there. She's got the fundamentals to play well, she just doesn't have the drive. To me, that means she deserves to play exactly where she is playing. Her coach is a good guy - I told her, I have no doubt if she changes her approach to the game she'll get more infield time. Guess we'll see what she does with that.

 

[FP26]

I may be in the minority, but I let my players know they have a spot on the team the next year if they wish to come back to me. I only coach 14U, so I have kids age out every year, and the younger players can decide whether they stay or go. It helps to have players who have played with me for a year to help the new players understand how things run on the team. They have to let me know before tryouts begin. If they tryout for other teams, they are in the same mix with the new players at that point. I try to be loyal to the kids who played for me and helped to develop. I've only cut one player in the last few years and that was for lack of effort. If they move on to a better team or a better fit, that is fine, but they have to understand it is a two-way street. Commit to play for me (with a deposit) or take your chances at tryouts. I hate this time of year, so if I can have a good roster without going through tryouts, all the better.

Same process with me, but at 16u.

 

[CoogansBluff]

I may be in the minority, but I let my players know they have a spot on the team the next year if they wish to come back to me. I only coach 14U, so I have kids age out every year, and the younger players can decide whether they stay or go. It helps to have players who have played with me for a year to help the new players understand how things run on the team. They have to let me know before tryouts begin. If they tryout for other teams, they are in the same mix with the new players at that point. I try to be loyal to the kids who played for me and helped to develop. I've only cut one player in the last few years and that was for lack of effort. If they move on to a better team or a better fit, that is fine, but they have to understand it is a two-way street. Commit to play for me (with a deposit) or take your chances at tryouts. I hate this time of year, so if I can have a good roster without going through tryouts, all the better.

I think this thread made you wonder if you're in the minority, but this is how a high majority of teams do and should operate. If you don't, you're either running a very serious outfit that is known to compete for national titles and you make that very clear, or you've got no soul, IMHO.

 

[Softball scholar]

In our area, I see a handful of organizations that are very aggressive and some people would define as cutthroat. But whatever you want to call them, these are the teams that get invited to the college show cases, exposure tournaments and other high level tournaments. So they have a lot of leverage on pulling talent from other teams that cant get the exposure. Its kinds of good old boys club where the top 7-8 orgs continually get invited to the big tournaments. The little guys get often get shut out even if they can compete. Also the colleges coaches have contacts with these orgs and are more likely to watch their players.

My DD plays on one a team from one of these orgs and there are pros and cons. She has to tryout again including paying the $20 tryout fee. The coaches aren't parents, but they're not staying. Even though DD had a good season, she has to have a good tryout to make the team. I guess you never know who will come in at tryouts, and might impress more than DD. We hope to stay, but have to tryout with other orgs just to hedge possibility of not making the team.

 

[Il softball fan]

My dd played for a team that was developed as nothing more than a feeder program for the local High school. Coach did not really care about winning games at the younger levels, only getting the players ready by high school age. If you were on the team, you had a spot the next year, and he didn't really turn anyone away. DD played two years of 10u and one year of 12u on this team, and we decided to move on.
Next team she played on for two seasons. Each year they had open tryouts, and no spots were guaranteed to returning players. That was at least what they said, but the core players did keep their spots each year, with a few additions. This is a pretty well known organization in our area, and the year my DD was first year 14U, they had so many kids show up for 14u tryouts, that they ended up having four 14u teams.

 

[MNDad]

A lot of cutthroat teams will carry 16-18 players not because they need them - but so other teams can't have them. They will only play their top 9-11 and tell the remaining girls parents that 'their DD is getting better here than with another team because of practices' and because 'she is part of a winning program'. I can't believe that ever works, but it does.

You're making too many assumptions. The "cut-throat" teams are simply offering a higher level of training and/or competition. They carry large rosters so they have enough girls to make in game adjustments and because older girls have other commitments and will often miss a tourney or two.

It works to tell the parents of girls who aren't in the top 9-11 "'their DD is getting better here than with another team" because it's often true. If a girl is good enough to be #13 or #14 on the best program in the area she'll learn far more than being #1 on a middle of the road program.

 

[slingnit]

A travel ball season is like a one year contract. Once the season is over, everyone is a free agent and the players have no obligation to that team and the coaches have no obligation to any player. Once the season ends, all roster spots are open. That's how I've always viewed it because that's how it was explained to me 6 seasons ago when my dd tried out for her first travel ball team.

I don't believe this to be true for most highly competitive teams. No spot is secure throughout the entire season. Teams disband through the year and those kids take spots on existing rosters. When national tournaments like ASA, PGF or even large exposures kids are picked up to play. They may even take the a spot of a kid still playing, right or wrong that is reality of competitive ball. So tryouts may be yearly or seasonally but security is nonexistent.