Cheating or Aggressive Base Running?

[MoJo]

People never cease to amaze.

The culture of "Win a any cost" is alive and well. And supported by those you would think should stand up against cheating.

 

[_MIA_]

People never cease to amaze.

The culture of "Win a any cost" is alive and well. And supported by those you would think should stand up against cheating.

You are confused.

 

[daywalkerdad]

Trick play question

So, am I to interpret that language as trick plays are unsportsmanlike?

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The only time I have seen this is for yelling, screaming etc to distract the pitcher. That may be a rule in itself.

 

[daywalkerdad]

I think this is a good discussion because there is obviously a difference, but I don't think you've made a good argument for why it's different. It just feels different, right? I agree. But that's not good enough for me.

Fouls are absolutely planned, practiced, and intended. Players are coached on how to get away with fouls. This is literally the exact same thing, isn't it? Teaching a DB how to get away with little pulls and grabs? Teaching guys in the paint how to create technically illegal contact that is not likely to get called? Players are coached on how to get away with breaking the rules. That fits a strict definition of cheating, but I think the reason we don't consider it as such is because they can still get caught. The same thing applies here. The team that tries this garbage move can still get caught, and the penalty is great enough that it should discourage a team from doing it.

Framing a pitch is dishonest. I was just pointing out that "dishonest" is not a great standard to use.

It's nothing like your examples. Those are all ways of gaining an "unnatural" advantage off the field. Except the cheap shot, which is different because the play we're all discussing happened in the view of three umpires (one of whom was staring directly at the play).

This comes down to all of us not liking how it looks. It's poor sportsmanship. But it's not actually objectively worse than a whole bunch of other stuff. In fact, it's actually less bad in practice because it's very, very easy to stop it from happening. Just appeal the play. It's one of the dumbest "trick plays," or attempts to cheat or whatever. I'm still unclear how this actually worked.

Framing a pitch is not dishonest. I think coaches and catchers are pretty honest that they frame pitches.
You are confusing consequence/severity vs morality.

 

[amakaa]

BTW- this team lost in the bottom of the 7th inning.

 

[The Man In Blue]

I was always taught the "appeal play" is a remnant of the days when umpires were true arbiters and only ruled in disputed calls the teams made themselves.

Could be an old myth.

I do not understand what is hard about this. The umpire CANNOT rule the runner out by rule. The defense MUST appeal. The umpire CAN eject the offenders BUT still CANNOT rule the runner out.

I am still on the fence with intent. I am still trying to find the case play or interpretation I mentioned before ... with that, I am OK with an ejection based on NFHS recognizing this is happening. Without that, the ground is a little less firm on intent. Unless you are the JUCO baseball team who pulled it six times in one season (Dawson Community College, Montana). Then your org/conference is calling you out.

 

[_MIA_]

I do not understand what is hard about this.

Some of us are apparently morally corrupt. I almost went to confession today because of this thread.

 

[The Man In Blue]

Some of us are apparently morally corrupt. I almost went to confession today because of this thread.

I can only imagine you in confession, throwing bottles of holy water back at the priest ...

 

[The Man In Blue]

BTW- this team lost in the bottom of the 7th inning.

 

[_MIA_]

I can only imagine you in confession, throwing bottles of holy water back at the priest ...

I am quite good at being contrite..have had lots of practice.