NFHS- International Tiebreaker- runner question

[Big Daddy Michigan]

I was watching a game under NFHS rules. It was tied in the 8th inning and they chose to go to International Tie-Breaker.

The batter who made the inning before was a slow runner. I was surprised they didn't pinch run for her. It made me wonder if you were allowed pinch run for her. Technically the "Batter who made the last out" is who the umpire said had to go to second. If you take that literally- then maybe you can't run for her.


The coach isn't what I would call a master strategist, so I'd be surprised if he even thought about pinch running.

 

[Cougars]

The coach isn't what I would call a master strategist, so I'd be surprised if he even thought about pinch running.

It happens. Hall of Fame MLB manager

Tony La Russa admits he didn't know new extra-innings rule after White Sox fall to Reds

The White Sox had their closer run the bases and La Russa didn't know he could have avoided it

www.cbssports.com

 

[marriard]

I was watching a game under NFHS rules. It was tied in the 8th inning and they chose to go to International Tie-Breaker.

The batter who made the inning before was a slow runner. I was surprised they didn't pinch run for her. It made me wonder if you were allowed pinch run for her. Technically the "Batter who made the last out" is who the umpire said had to go to second. If you take that literally- then maybe you can't run for her.


The coach isn't what I would call a master strategist, so I'd be surprised if he even thought about pinch running.

Yes you are allowed to legally substitute for the runner in ITB.

 

[Dabears17]

What annoyed me one 8u tournament when coaching was the player to be placed on 2B was the catcher, so the coach courtesy ran for her. This is 8u.

 

[MoJo]

What annoyed me one 8u tournament when coaching was to be placed on 2B was the catcher, so the coach courtesy ran for her. This is 8u.

WTH?

 

[Big Daddy Michigan]

Yes you are allowed to legally substitute for the runner in ITB.

I would have thought so, but when they didn't do it, with the slowest girl on the team on second, I thought perhaps they weren't allowed to.

 

[eddieq]

I was watching a game under NFHS rules. It was tied in the 8th inning and they chose to go to International Tie-Breaker.

The batter who made the inning before was a slow runner. I was surprised they didn't pinch run for her. It made me wonder if you were allowed pinch run for her. Technically the "Batter who made the last out" is who the umpire said had to go to second. If you take that literally- then maybe you can't run for her.


The coach isn't what I would call a master strategist, so I'd be surprised if he even thought about pinch running.

Technically it's the "batter scheduled to bat last" is placed on second (USA rules) which honestly often is the last out. I believe that NFHS has a "tie is allowed, unless the state association has a tie-breaker procedure" so "last out" may be what their wording has. For example, my state, PIAA adopted NHFS and adds rule 4-2-5 "tie-breaker procedure, upon completion of 9 innings the player who last completed her turn at bat is placed on 2nd base"

Semantics.

 

[Big Daddy Michigan]

Technically it's the "batter scheduled to bat last" is placed on second (USA rules) which honestly often is the last out. I believe that NFHS has a "tie is allowed, unless the state association has a tie-breaker procedure" so "last out" may be what their wording has. For example, my state, PIAA adopted NHFS and adds rule 4-2-5 "tie-breaker procedure, upon completion of 9 innings the player who last completed her turn at bat is placed on 2nd base"

Semantics.

"The batter who made the last out" was the words he used, and it was the batter scheduled to bat last, so maybe it was just the way he worded it versus what the rule book says.

I thought it was odd because does that mean if B1 is out then B2 is out then the next 2 batters hit home runs then the next batter singles but gets out stealing second that B2 is the runner, because she was "BATTER who made the last out."

I'm sure I'm just over thinking this, but still.

 

[eddieq]

Yeah, and certainly I'm not arguing with you on the semantics here. As an umpire, I find I prefer to use rulebook language to avoid confusion. Many coaches and umpires use their interpretation of what they read/heard or just MSU. A huge game of whisper down the lane on lesser used rules like these.

 

[The Man In Blue]

"The batter who made the last out" was the words he used, and it was the batter scheduled to bat last, so maybe it was just the way he worded it versus what the rule book says.

I thought it was odd because does that mean if B1 is out then B2 is out then the next 2 batters hit home runs then the next batter singles but gets out stealing second that B2 is the runner, because she was "BATTER who made the last out."

I'm sure I'm just over thinking this, but still.

Not overthinking it at all. This is why tournaments need to really think things through if they are messing with the rulebook. Usually this is more the case with courtesy runners than tie-breaks.

Last out = whoever made the last out in any fashion (so a runner caught stealing would count)
Last batted out = last batter who completed an at bat but did not successfully reach base
Furthest removed = the person in the batting lineup immediately before the batter who is leading off the inning

Here is a fun one ... If they are using "last out" and R1 is put out on a ground ball ... who made the last out? R1 or the batter?

Umpires need to know what the tournament is doing and be proactive. It will save headaches.

To the OP's question about NFHS though, NFHS does not have a tiebreaker provision. They allow states to adopt their own, so there is not a standard here.