I suspect organization of stealing player funds

[Sparky Guy]

The team is intact. The player uniforms were purchased with player fees. The team equipment was purchased with player fees. The organization is claiming that the equipment is a contribution to and therefore belongs to the organization, not to the team.

It sounds like the organization is doing what every one that I've been involved with does. Uniforms, bat bags, spirit wear and such belongs to the players. Each year there is team equipment such as nets, wiffle balls, game balls, practice balls and various other things the team needs to practice/play with which needs to be added, repaired or replaced. Experienced organizations figure that amount into the team budget. That "team" equipment stays with the organization. If the same coach stays with an organization it may look like the coach is "keeping" the equipment. When, in fact, he is holding it for the start of the next season. If the coach leaves the organization the equipment is supposed to be returned to the organization.

It sounds like the organization used the wrong term with parents. Instead of using the word "donated" they should have stated "team equipment maintenance" or something like that.

As others have stated. I think you're chasing the wrong rabbit here. $100 per player sounds a little high. I used to figure $500 for the team for the year. Most of the times I came real close to spending it. Like everything else the price of equipment is going up each year.

 

[grounded]

Like others, having a hard time following without knowing the full story. One thing that does come to mind is if this happens to be a multi team org...using "your" equipment for another team within the org, then hitting your team up to replace the equipment that they distributed within the org. Think I would be little angry with that if it were the case

 

[daddiox2]

I agree with sparky.

 

[Momo'sDad]

Thanks, Sparky. For the org in question, there is a per-season fee charged to each player for organizational expenses, which would cover ongoing maintenance and those items an org needs to operate that may not be readily visible to the parents paying the tab. I'm completely fine with that.

Parents who join most orgs with 18u programs in this area accept that an annual "fundraiser" exists for the benefit of the 18u team. For a variety of reasons, I've never really been a huge fan of that practice myself, but it's part of the deal when you buy in and the presumption is that you'll someday be on the receiving end of that subsidy if your DD continues playing ball, even if you're with a different org.

This feels like double dipping, though, something else I know that's very popular in local governments around Sacramento.

 

[YOCOACH]

I have seen it both ways MD. I guess what it comes down to is who initially purchased the equipment. If the organization did, even with players fees which went into a general fund then the organization cut the check from that fund, it would belong to them.

In our old rec league, the players fees included their uniforms, 2 tournaments fees, field rental, umpires fees for league play, etc. etc. and they got to keep the uniforms which were paid for en masse for the entire league from the general fund. Yet, at the end of the season, all of the equipment, which was paid for the same way, got turned in so the organization could go through it and repair or replace broken/worn equipment. Once that happened, if the coach was returning the following year or coaching Fall Ball, we got the equipment back. However, if we were leaving, the equipment had to go back to the organization.

In other words, the organization purchased 200 bats with the general fund for all of the teams and split them amongst the number of teams. Even though this is considered team equipment, it still belongs to the organization.

In our TB organization, the players fees include tournament fees for x number of tournaments per year, new bat bag, helmet and 2 uniforms w/socks which are theirs to keep. However, as on most TB teams in our area, the coaches have personally purchased the team equipment initially. So, our organization returns $200 per team to the HC to replace/ repair team equipment as needed or purchase something that the team wants. Since the initial outlay was by us, the coaches, whatever we get is considered ours and would go with us and our team if we switched organizations.

 

[dbronstein]

I still don't understand what the issue is. It sounds like the parents paid money to the organization, the org purchased equipment for the team, and the org is taking the equipment back after the season. Is that right?

That seems pretty standard to me. That's how our org works - the families pay the registration fees to the org, and the org buys all the equipment, pays for the field permits, league registration, etc. After the season, the coaches return the equipment to the org and the org manages it from there. The org also keeps any leftover money, which I don't have a problem with. They use it for scholarships for players who can't afford the fees and stuff like that.

Uniforms are purchased directly by the families so that money doesn't go through the org at all, and players keep the unis after the season.

 

[RookKev]

That's how I read it too. Momo's team wants to hold on to their stuff, be it with this org or go independent. And, well, that's not how this org appears to run. Sorry, team fees will be up when you break away, and you will have to get new equipment it looks like.

 

[Momo'sDad]

Yes, we'd like to keep what we paid for. I admit that I struggle to deal with people and groups who aren't that smart or who act in shortsighted ways. That's a personal flaw. Assuming that I eventually just drop it, the net result is that 2 of the previous 6 teams have now departed. So, the org is saying "we need to hoard what we can right now to mitigate the loss", not realizing that acting in that manner is going to make it far more difficult to replace those open slots with newcomers.

It's highly doubtful any area 01 or 02 coach will go there, and when this came down, they lost a golden chance to get an experienced 04 coach and team for the spring. Meanwhile, the orgs with the bigger names among showcase teams have begun creeping down into the lower ages, starting new teams in 12s and now even 10s. Maybe our former group will get lucky with the 04s next fall, but if you're a bad actor and word gets out about that, it can be hard to overcome in such a tight market. It can sometimes take a program 2-3 years to recover following a single "incident".

At least with 1 of the larger orgs up here, the owner makes it pretty clear that the younger teams are there to subsidize the 18 gold program. lol Oh well. Thanks to everyone for the insights.

 

[Indiana]

They do own it, but not because of their non-profit status. As long as they are registered as any sort of organized group, complete with an EIN (or tax ID number) then they are the owner of all money deposited into their account and all capital equipment purchased with that money. Technically, they are supposed to keep records of all of their capital expenditures, as they are considered assets. It doesn't matter that they keep separate player accounts; as long as you are all under one tax ID number you are considered to be one entity. The honorable thing would be for the organization to let your team, and its equipment (they could gift or "grant" it to you), go if you are unhappy, but they don't have to.

By "standards and practices", they could be referring to their by-laws, which, as a non-profit, they do need to have. They need to have by-laws, a list of officers, and regular open meetings with minutes.

 

[Amy in AZ.]

I always ask parents if they know how their dues are being spent and they never do. Doesn't a non-profit have to have annual meetings and treasurer reports?

Good luck. I see several coaches start teams and keep equipment. I don't know why they would want it.