tough coaching decision - time limit game

[29dad]

Thanks all. I had a great time reading all of the posts. One last bit of good news to share - it appears that our 4th place finish from an earlier qualifier was good enough to receive an ASA/USA berth, as two berths have passed down (found out yesterday). So although it was tough to lose the game I described in the original post, karma seems to have blessed us with a berth after all. It has been a struggle this year as our number one pitcher threw 1/3 of an inning in the first inning of our first tournament before being lost for the season (although there is till hope she will be back for nationals) and our number 2 pitcher is still recovering from ACL surgery last fall and is practically pitching on one leg. Suffice it to say that we could use a break and although it's a bit cheap to get a berth by finishing 4th, we'll take it.

 

[SoCalASABlue]

Thanks all. I had a great time reading all of the posts. One last bit of good news to share - it appears that our 4th place finish from an earlier qualifier was good enough to receive an ASA/USA berth, as two berths have passed down (found out yesterday). So although it was tough to lose the game I described in the original post, karma seems to have blessed us with a berth after all. It has been a struggle this year as our number one pitcher threw 1/3 of an inning in the first inning of our first tournament before being lost for the season (although there is till hope she will be back for nationals) and our number 2 pitcher is still recovering from ACL surgery last fall and is practically pitching on one leg. Suffice it to say that we could use a break and although it's a bit cheap to get a berth by finishing 4th, we'll take it.

Congrats - nothing cheap about it - good luck!

 

[softballphreak]

The sport, fastpitch, may not have a time limit, but you're playing a modified game of that sport when you agree to enter these tournaments. The clock matters.

People can whine, cry, complain, moan, groan, dislike, show disgust, call it unfair, a travesty, never agree with, rant and rave to the TD and/or umpires and/or opposing coaches, what have you, but it's not going to change. It's a modified game from what you think it should be.

Perhaps some here should host no-time limit tournaments? Maybe teams will come from far and wide to enter?

Back in the day there were more tournaments that had 7-inning games. They were the good old days.

TD would run 45 minute games if they could get away with it (and they probably can). The more teams allowed in a tournament (actually most everyone calls them showcases nowadays) the more money the TD rakes in.

I dislike time-limited games. It's particularly distasteful when there is no time out that stops the clock. Except maybe a serious injury.

But the thing I hate most of all is a drop dead game. It's disgusting and unsportsmanlike not to allow a batter to finish their at bat! Nothing worthy about it! Doesn't make any sense at all!

 

[GOINGDEEP]

Back in the day there were more tournaments that had 7-inning games. They were the good old days.

TD would run 45 minute games if they could get away with it (and they probably can). The more teams allowed in a tournament (actually most everyone calls them showcases nowadays) the more money the TD rakes in.

You're right, it's a HUGE cash crop now compared to when I was a youth ( 30 years ago when I was 10 and moving forward ). I grew up and played in Memphis, population of a million, know how many true travel ball teams we had...............3. Same area now you couldn't throw a dead cat and not hit 10 TB teams.

But, one thing I'd like to point out, even though BB TB doesn't do 7 inning games anymore, most of the "major" level tournaments ( A class comparable in SB ) are 90 min games compared to the mostly 75 min games in softball.

 

[SCDad]

I have seen coaches STALL in the 2nd inning, with a lead, only to bite them.

It is not the rules (time limit) that is the problem. It is the COACHES ... who think I can manipulate these rules to my advantage. What is more important, We WIN the game, or keep the INTEGRITY of the game intact?

Too many coaches favor the WIN, over the integrity. FORGET about the parents who actually pay for the game, they don't matter. We don't talk to them. For there is another batch of deprived, DD elevating group of parents, ready to pay money next year.

The travel game has trouble. It is getting worse and worse. Been there, done that. You understand better when on the outside, looking in.

At one point (hopefully soon) the folks inside the fence, all of them, will understand ... hey listen, the parents are paying for us to be here. Lets make sure we are conducting ourselves in a manner that keeps them wanting to pay us to do so.

Parents don't want to pay for pitching changes, super extended arguments, extra trips to the circle, having 15 player rosters, making players do push-ups in play, fiddling with line-up changes to stall, I could go on and on. Have seen most of it.

The DRAMA coaches think up to "win" games is beyond me. Most all parents are in disgust. Many cannot afford it. Yet everyone in travel wonders WHY?

Play the game right. Keep it moving. Keep your rosters down. Be respectful of the parents back pocket. Start there. If not, the travel game is on a downhill trend. Way too many folks taking advantage of the paying customer. And wonder in amazement when one of the highest organizations in the land cannot field a full tournament (no names).

 

[Rocketech1]

While I dislike timed games, I see no difference with coaches who are trying to speed up the game to get to the next inning and coaches who slow down the game to not see another inning. Both are trying to use the clock to their advantage. It's just another factor in the many factors that help coaches decide what strategy to implore during the game. When coaching in timed games, around 20 mins until no new inning, I start thinking about clock management. If we have a several run lead we start slowing the game down, if we are behind in runs we play at a quicker pace. I have been in several games when we were up by a run or two and missed the no new inning by 30 seconds and ended up losing the game in the next inning. That should never happen if we used good clock management in the previous inning.

Again I wish all game were 7 innings but that is not a reality at most tournaments unless you have great pitching and quick innings or you are in the championship game.

 

[SCDad]

While I dislike timed games, I see no difference with coaches who are trying to speed up the game to get to the next inning and coaches who slow down the game to not see another inning. Both are trying to use the clock to their advantage. It's just another factor in the many factors that help coaches decide what strategy to implore during the game. When coaching in timed games, around 20 mins until no new inning, I start thinking about clock management. If we have a several run lead we start slowing the game down, if we are behind in runs we play at a quicker pace. I have been in several games when we were up by a run or two and missed the no new inning by 30 seconds and ended up losing the game in the next inning. That should never happen if we used good clock management in the previous inning.

Again I wish all game were 7 innings but that is not a reality at most tournaments unless you have great pitching and quick innings or you are in the championship game.

Speeding up the game ... versus S .. L .. O .. W .. I .. N .. G ... it down are the same? You have no clue, really.

When I was a parent paying to watch my DD play, I paid to watch an efficient game of softball. I did not pay to watch all the extras from a multitude of coaches, players, umpires, S.. L ..O ..W ..I .. N ..G, the game down.

Until this fundemental principle is understood by the people INSIDE the fence, it is a problem. Because, 90% of the paying customer are on my side. They just do not know what to do. they a jaded by the incessant need to have DD succeed. They do not know how to explain.

I know, and know how to explain. But the folks getting paid (coaches) don't think it matters ... sigh.

 

[softballphreak]

Time limited games are the problem, not the strategies the coaches use to take advantage of it. There is no way to have a fair time limited game unless there are provisions for time outs. Just no way!

I've often wondered why they don't just have a 5-inning game in lieu of a time limited game.

 

[Rocketech1]

Speeding up the game ... versus S .. L .. O .. W .. I .. N .. G ... it down are the same? You have no clue, really.

When I was a parent paying to watch my DD play, I paid to watch an efficient game of softball. I did not pay to watch all the extras from a multitude of coaches, players, umpires, S.. L ..O ..W ..I .. N ..G, the game down.

Until this fundemental principle is understood by the people INSIDE the fence, it is a problem. Because, 90% of the paying customer are on my side. They just do not know what to do. they a jaded by the incessant need to have DD succeed. They do not know how to explain.

I know, and know how to explain. But the folks getting paid (coaches) don't think it matters ... sigh.

So every other sport that is timed like basketball, football, soccer etc use clock management as a strategy but somehow if softball has timed games, coaches shouldn't use the clock to gain an advantage because it somehow ruins the spirit of the game or parents don't get to see Suzy get one more at bat?

 

[riseball]

Speeding up the game ... versus S .. L .. O .. W .. I .. N .. G ... it down are the same? You have no clue, really.

When I was a parent paying to watch my DD play, I paid to watch an efficient game of softball. I did not pay to watch all the extras from a multitude of coaches, players, umpires, S.. L ..O ..W ..I .. N ..G, the game down.

Until this fundemental principle is understood by the people INSIDE the fence, it is a problem. Because, 90% of the paying customer are on my side. They just do not know what to do. they a jaded by the incessant need to have DD succeed. They do not know how to explain.

I know, and know how to explain. But the folks getting paid (coaches) don't think it matters ... sigh.

Sounds like just another self absorbed, whining parent that carps non-stop about how it should be.

...sigh