Lessons $$$$ or Ethics/Purpose/Goal

[daywalkerdad]

In general I do not see an ethics issue, I would argue similar to student paying for college not going to class, buying a gym membership then never going.
Some may be taking lessons with a different timeline and goals.
Coaches should however be honest. No “your kid could go d1”, when hs varsity maybe a stretch to keep the kid in lessons. As long as everyone knows expectations.

 

[Northball]

... No “your kid could go d1”, when hs varsity maybe a stretch to keep the kid in lessons...

^^^To me this would be a much greater violation of ethics.^^^
I really don't have a problem with the first question as long as the person writing the checks understands why their kid will be surpassed by others.

 

[Gambler Bob]

In general I do not see an ethics issue, I would argue similar to student paying for college not going to class, buying a gym membership then never going.
Some may be taking lessons with a different timeline and goals.
Coaches should however be honest. No “your kid could go d1”, when hs varsity maybe a stretch to keep the kid in lessons. As long as everyone knows expectations.

I agree with this response. What is even more odd, is that his analogy actually makes perfect sense for this question. Usually the analogies that I read on this forum or horrible.

No, I do not think it is unethical for a hitting instructor or any other type of baseball/softball instructor to take a families money when the child is not doing their own work outside of lessons. I look at at this way, not every kid can be a collegiate athlete. The lesser talented kids are helping to keep the lights on at the facility.

 

[joe720]

Can't blame an instructor when organizations have feeder teams. Entire teams to help fund the better team.

 

[4Martini]

As a parent I tell my daughter - I will pay for pitching lessons as long as you pitch at least three days a week outside of practice. But, if a parent is willing to pay for a once a week lesson/ practice and you are clear that their progress will be slower than your other students who practice more I see nothing unethical about it.

There are still a lot of parents who are doing sports for reasons other than chasing D1. I was talking to a friend about this and she told me her daughter’s therapist charged $150/ hour and didn’t make her as happy as the lessons she was taking - so she paid for lessons while her daughter got through a bunch of completely unrelated bad stuff - because it was a normal in her life that grounded her. She knew her daughter was not getting much better at the sport- but that wasn’t as important as having some normality in her life while something much bigger was going on.

The teen years are hard- realize you might be adding a ton of value that you can’t see in a child’s life.

But it’s also okay to decide your business is about progress and take on clients who are on the same page.

 

[Northball]

As a parent I tell my daughter - I will pay for pitching lessons as long as you pitch at least three days a week outside of practice. But, if a parent is willing to pay for a once a week lesson/ practice and you are clear that their progress will be slower than your other students who practice more I see nothing unethical about it.

There are still a lot of parents who are doing sports for reasons other than chasing D1. I was talking to a friend about this and she told me her daughter’s therapist charged $150/ hour and didn’t make her as happy as the lessons she was taking - so she paid for lessons while her daughter got through a bunch of completely unrelated bad stuff - because it was a normal in her life that grounded her. She knew her daughter was not getting much better at the sport- but that wasn’t as important as having some normality in her life while something much bigger was going on.

The teen years are hard- realize you might be adding a ton of value that you can’t see in a child’s life.

But it’s also okay to decide your business is about progress and take on clients who are on the same page.

$150/hr? Maybe I should switch from DiscussFastPitch.com to DiscussFreudianPsychology.com

 

[PJR202]

I'm still relatively new to it, but I stress the importance of work outside of a lesson. I give them simple stuff that can be done in the house or into a net somewhere. I tell them I'm the instructor and their parent is the coach.

I honestly don't think I would want to keep working with a kid that wasn't working outside of lessons unless they were still making progress. It would be soul crushing to have a kid in there who wasnt improving even 1%.

If I did it for all or a significant portion of my income I could probably put up with it.

 

[Orange Socks]

I played golf yesterday with mixed results. Awesome shots and then just horrible shots. Why? Because I do NOT practice. No consistency. Why should I expect to play well without practice? I told myself I WILL NOT play a round again until I got to the range two times to hit 100 balls each session. Kind of like tee work.

 

[FP26]

Ethics is a difficult question. I work in retail. If a customer chooses to purchase something but then decides not to use it, is selling it to them unethical on my part? My assumption is that they are going to use it. Why else would they buy it?

My viewpoint on this is probably a bit different than others. At one point in time I worked with between 15-20 hitting students. I was not paid for my services. If they wanted to have the lesson at the local cages, it was their responsibility to pay for the cage, but I didn't make a dime. That said, some of the dads did pick up pizza for after the lesson so we could hang out and chat, but I digress. In general I was able to tell if the student's approach and mechanics were improving. If I got the sense that they were not working outside of our lessons I would ask them about their interest or desire. Perhaps I needed to adjust my approach. Perhaps I was not the best instructor for that particular student. Ultimately my goal was to help however I could. If that meant having them work with a different instructor, so be it.

 

[RADcatcher]

Thank you to posters for offering feedback and discussion points.

Ethics is a difficult question. I work in retail. If a customer chooses to purchase something but then decides not to use it, is selling it to them unethical on my part?
My assumption is that they are going to use it. Why else would they buy it?

Using this analogy/ comparison.
(For purpose of topic let's say it's ongoing lessons and not just one two or three)
A parent buys their kid/ teenager something that costs $1,000 or more. If they were to buy their kid $1,000 guitar or bicycle or? Whatever for $1000... once the item leaves the store there is no further connection.
The item gets home and can just sit in the corner.

In school teachers are paid an hourly wage and a group of students sit and get the same instruction/lessons. It is up to the student and potentially responsible party would be a parent for the classroom lessons to be applied and learned.
Per semester or yearly the classroom will change students. Revolving door situation. Same pay for teacher.

On a one and one basis of instruction. Sports lessons. Can see that retail purchase comparison however because it is connected with teaching...
And does *not have to be revolving door situation like classrooms. Adds a different Factor into this conversation of what the purpose is of offering lessons.

This is where I think there's a difference of money and time.

$$$$, Without regard for if the student doesnt practice and can be a revolving door of students, wouldn't matter because it's just to earn money.

Then there is the purpose and goal of why lessons are being offered. What money can buy is a spot of opportunity.
For me, because there are limited spots available on the schedule. What I have always considered really important is the purpose and goal of developing softball players. While it may be difficult to get to a point to ask people to step off the schedule.
I know that opening up that spot will open an opportunity to another softball student who has a purpose and goal. The purpose and goal will be fulfilled, money will still come in!