That is crazy to me...the thought of a dad volunteering to be asst coach on a highschool team. There are NO volunteers at our highschool. The coaches are paid teachers/coaches...primarily coaches (probably teach Health too)...the softball head coach is also the Athletic Chairperson at DD's school. I would balk if I knew volunteers were coaching a high school team; but at the same time, I understand budget limits and "different strokes for different folks" in that it depends on the community. We are in Texas, and sports are huge in Texas...of course, we're not doing so well in some aspects (i.e. basketball)...but it seems school districts make sure there is room in budget for sports. LOL.
Is HS ball becoming *BETTER* than TB?
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That is crazy to me...the thought of a dad volunteering to be asst coach on a highschool team. There are NO volunteers at our highschool. The coaches are paid teachers/coaches...primarily coaches (probably teach Health too)...the softball head coach is also the Athletic Chairperson at DD's school. I would balk if I knew volunteers were coaching a high school team; but at the same time, I understand budget limits and "different strokes for different folks" in that it depends on the community. We are in Texas, and sports are huge in Texas...of course, we're not doing so well in some aspects (i.e. basketball)...but it seems school districts make sure there is room in budget for sports. LOL.
Sluggers--Benet is a pretty unusual team, really stacked. I guess the scenario you paint "waters down" travel a bit, but true A+ travel teams and B+ travel teams still don't really cross paths and more girls playing and more opportunities for all is a good thing.
If anything, high school top 20 and state playoffs in a strong area like Chicago suburbs is replacing travel in terms of *competition* -- ie, so much of travel now is about exposure where teams aren't even really playing to win. Teams get kudos for winning Metros and competing at ASA or Premier Nationals but almost every other weekend exposure of some sort or another seems to trump competitive tournaments.
If anything, high school top 20 and state playoffs in a strong area like Chicago suburbs is replacing travel in terms of *competition* -- ie, so much of travel now is about exposure where teams aren't even really playing to win. Teams get kudos for winning Metros and competing at ASA or Premier Nationals but almost every other weekend exposure of some sort or another seems to trump competitive tournaments.
What is the harm in having more travel ball teams?
Are you saying that there should be no avenue for kids who want to play 12 softball tournaments just for the fun of it?
I follow high school sports very closely, and in the areas that I have been, this scenario is very rare. Coaches are on faculty/staff. There are occasional community coaches, but I don't know of any examples of them being parents. I know of one high school, for example, who hired a community coach who was a recently graduated All-ACC shortstop w/ no children. A community coach w/ a kid on the team is not qualified.
Interesting topic Sluggers. Im going to try to mix in many years ago growing up, and what I've seen in the past four years with DD.
Growing up EVERY baseball player who was any good ( or college bound ) played HS ball. That's just the way it was, HS ball in the spring and travel in the summer. I've witnessed this same trend growing more and more popular in softball.
For me, I believe it's a powerful recruiting position. Baseball has been using it for years. You can email a college all day long telling them you play for X travel team, give them your stats, where you have played, yada yada. BUT, where is the proof? Some cheap website the team made?
Or you can email the same college with multiple media articles with a tad more proof of accomplishments, something that will catch their attention. Wins/losses, BA, ERA, stolen bases, HR's, strikeouts, fielding %, etc. Thats free exposure. Most sports writers are at the games, they see what's happening, they are not going to print some exaggerated stats and risk losing credibility.
HS ball also has the advantage of records. If you're that once in a decade stud you're going to have media proof of "best BA, ERA, wins" in the area/state since 19__, 20__. If you're a team of studs same rule applies.
Next is awards. Usually the college bound material players are the ones who win awards in their state HS organizations. All district, all tournament, all region, all state, pitcher of the year, batter of the year, student athlete of the year, best of the preps award, State Sports Writers athlete of the year, on and on.
^^^^^^^ All these things really dress up an email sent to colleges. They get 1000's, you want SOMETHING to catch their eye........to separate you from the other 999.
Remember you are trying to interest the college enough to come see you at a HS game or come see you at a travel ball event in the summer, or even start following your success via the Internet in HS. It's all about getting their attention, and HS ball is a great way to open that door.
In our state travel and HS ball go together like peanut butter and jelly. When we go to these HS tourneys the fun part is seeing that school X is mostly made up by travel team Y players. And those numbers have risen every year in my DD's HS career.
Growing up EVERY baseball player who was any good ( or college bound ) played HS ball. That's just the way it was, HS ball in the spring and travel in the summer. I've witnessed this same trend growing more and more popular in softball.
For me, I believe it's a powerful recruiting position. Baseball has been using it for years. You can email a college all day long telling them you play for X travel team, give them your stats, where you have played, yada yada. BUT, where is the proof? Some cheap website the team made?
Or you can email the same college with multiple media articles with a tad more proof of accomplishments, something that will catch their attention. Wins/losses, BA, ERA, stolen bases, HR's, strikeouts, fielding %, etc. Thats free exposure. Most sports writers are at the games, they see what's happening, they are not going to print some exaggerated stats and risk losing credibility.
HS ball also has the advantage of records. If you're that once in a decade stud you're going to have media proof of "best BA, ERA, wins" in the area/state since 19__, 20__. If you're a team of studs same rule applies.
Next is awards. Usually the college bound material players are the ones who win awards in their state HS organizations. All district, all tournament, all region, all state, pitcher of the year, batter of the year, student athlete of the year, best of the preps award, State Sports Writers athlete of the year, on and on.
^^^^^^^ All these things really dress up an email sent to colleges. They get 1000's, you want SOMETHING to catch their eye........to separate you from the other 999.
Remember you are trying to interest the college enough to come see you at a HS game or come see you at a travel ball event in the summer, or even start following your success via the Internet in HS. It's all about getting their attention, and HS ball is a great way to open that door.
In our state travel and HS ball go together like peanut butter and jelly. When we go to these HS tourneys the fun part is seeing that school X is mostly made up by travel team Y players. And those numbers have risen every year in my DD's HS career.
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- Jul 26, 2010
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We have a lot of private schools out here who give "academic scholarships" to sports stars. Softball is one of those sports where the great players are almost always great students, which is very different then a lot of male sports. There are certainly schools with great softball programs that seem to "attract" a large number of softball players who's families could not afford these schools otherwise.
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We see a similar situation here in CO with private schools and football. The powerhouse team last fall was a private high school who has burst onto the scene quite recently.
Interestingly, we don't see private high school softball powerhouses - there are one or two but they don't play in the top division.
Colorado has an interesting wrinkle in that a student may open enroll into any public school that they wish to. TB programs have become feeders which take from a few high school areas within a county. Those girls are then open enrolling into their program's high school of choice. I'm starting to see entire TB teams open enroll into one school. Conversely, some girls will open enroll out of their home school to find more playing time or better opportunities elsewhere (for example, their home school is full up on pitching so they enroll into a school that needs a pitcher). This still all happens within a 20 minute drive or so - I've yet to witness hour long HS commutes.
In our area, the improvement in HS programs isn't due to a favorable comparison with diluted TB teams, it rather seems to be due to the proliferation of TB and the subsequent improvement in geographical pockets.
Interestingly, we don't see private high school softball powerhouses - there are one or two but they don't play in the top division.
Colorado has an interesting wrinkle in that a student may open enroll into any public school that they wish to. TB programs have become feeders which take from a few high school areas within a county. Those girls are then open enrolling into their program's high school of choice. I'm starting to see entire TB teams open enroll into one school. Conversely, some girls will open enroll out of their home school to find more playing time or better opportunities elsewhere (for example, their home school is full up on pitching so they enroll into a school that needs a pitcher). This still all happens within a 20 minute drive or so - I've yet to witness hour long HS commutes.
In our area, the improvement in HS programs isn't due to a favorable comparison with diluted TB teams, it rather seems to be due to the proliferation of TB and the subsequent improvement in geographical pockets.
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^^^ Agree with SS. You really can't compare a private school program with public schools. "They say they don't recruit", however they sure win plenty of State Titles in Oregon, and I mean in several sports, not just 1 or 2.
- Nov 29, 2009
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Right now travel ball keeps shooting itself in the foot. The biggest problem is organizations who are carrying too many teams at an age level. There are several in the Chicago area who are carrying 3-4 teams at the 14-16U levels. This has severely diluted the top level talent pool. Currently it's next to impossible to get a player if you need one. Look at the ads section on ETeamz and you'll see many, many ads looking for players.
Someone mentioned it was a good thing to dilute the talent. I wholeheartedly disagree. Put the top players together and let them compete at the national level. The others will seek their own level. Bill Conroy is a master recruiter of the top talent in the Chicago area and he also reaches across state lines. He used to recruit one player at a time for his older teams. The last couple of years he's been taking complete younger teams under the Bandit umbrella. Time will tell if that works for him and the kids on the team. In the mean time the other top programs in the area will fight over the remaining talent.
As for HS ball. It's a cyclical thing that depends on pitching. Teams who have pitching win. It's that simple or they had a group of good hitters, not just one or two. In the Chicago area the SW suburbs had the strongest teams in the state year after year. With the building boom communities built more schools. The top players who would have played together are now competing against each other instead of with each other. The team that Sluggers mentioned is having a good run right now. Who knows what's going to happen when the next group of kids come through. There is another private school that was just ranked #1 in the area in the latest Suntimes edition. This team has been nothing but stats fodder for the last 5-6 years. They have pitching this year.
Went and watched my DD's HS alma mater play last night against a sister school in the district that was recently built. While the play was OK, it was not of the same caliber as before. Each team had a few good players, but not enough to make them better than a top travel team.
Someone mentioned it was a good thing to dilute the talent. I wholeheartedly disagree. Put the top players together and let them compete at the national level. The others will seek their own level. Bill Conroy is a master recruiter of the top talent in the Chicago area and he also reaches across state lines. He used to recruit one player at a time for his older teams. The last couple of years he's been taking complete younger teams under the Bandit umbrella. Time will tell if that works for him and the kids on the team. In the mean time the other top programs in the area will fight over the remaining talent.
As for HS ball. It's a cyclical thing that depends on pitching. Teams who have pitching win. It's that simple or they had a group of good hitters, not just one or two. In the Chicago area the SW suburbs had the strongest teams in the state year after year. With the building boom communities built more schools. The top players who would have played together are now competing against each other instead of with each other. The team that Sluggers mentioned is having a good run right now. Who knows what's going to happen when the next group of kids come through. There is another private school that was just ranked #1 in the area in the latest Suntimes edition. This team has been nothing but stats fodder for the last 5-6 years. They have pitching this year.
Went and watched my DD's HS alma mater play last night against a sister school in the district that was recently built. While the play was OK, it was not of the same caliber as before. Each team had a few good players, but not enough to make them better than a top travel team.
Indiana brings up a good point. Private schools "can" look like a powerhouse mostly because of the division they play in. I believe 90% of our private schools play in single A, 10% in AA. Those divisions are a cake walk.
We got a private school 5 mins from the house, 2011 state champs, 2012 #4 in state playoffs. If you looked at their stats ( solely without knowing the background ) you'd think they were the best in the country. So far I believe they are undefeated, and most games are run ruled. They don't play anyone remotely strong until they reach state, and even then those A/AA teams wouldn't last 2 games in the AAA ( highest ) brackets.
This same "private powerhouse" WILL NOT enter any HS tourneys, and we all know why, they would be quickly exposed as weak. This weekend we have another HS tourney, every HS in the county is playing in it. Anyone want to guess the only school NOT entered??
We got a private school 5 mins from the house, 2011 state champs, 2012 #4 in state playoffs. If you looked at their stats ( solely without knowing the background ) you'd think they were the best in the country. So far I believe they are undefeated, and most games are run ruled. They don't play anyone remotely strong until they reach state, and even then those A/AA teams wouldn't last 2 games in the AAA ( highest ) brackets.
This same "private powerhouse" WILL NOT enter any HS tourneys, and we all know why, they would be quickly exposed as weak. This weekend we have another HS tourney, every HS in the county is playing in it. Anyone want to guess the only school NOT entered??
