Is HS ball becoming *BETTER* than TB?

[sluggers]

My observation about the proliferation of TB teams and the subsequent dilution of talent:

I've noticed something odd...the HS teams are getting *better* than most of the TB teams in Chicagoland. It seems that a few powerhouse TB teams are attracting most of the high caliber TB players. As a result, the remaining TB teams that don't even have one outstanding player.

On the other hand, everyone on the HS teams play TB due to the large number of TB teams out there, and the HS teams all have at least one or two players from the powerhouse TB teams. The result is that the HS teams, by and large, could beat most of the TB teams.

E.g., Benet Academy (an excellent private school in the western burbs of Chicagoland) has a kid going to Georgia (SEC), one going to Illinois (Big 10), one going to Providence (Big 8), one going to Northwestern (Big 10) and one going to Georgia Southern (Sun Belt). There aren't many TB teams outside of the PAC 10 with five players going D1. I suspect that Benet could give a number of the upper echelon TB teams a good game.

 

[InsidePitch]

The No 1 team in NJ is an all girls school, Immaculate Heart Academy. They were 32-0 last year and have started off the same this year. They played a team tonight who's pitcher just had a perfect game, 21ks. Even against a bad team that is something. They squeaked it by. The tweet from the IHA coach...Great pitching performances from Ally Frei and Steph Thomas. We also played great D. Won 1-0 on a suicide Squeeze. FWIW, IHA does have at least 6 gold level players that I'm aware of.

 

[starsnuffer]

HS ball is getting better out here as well. As for travel ball getting worse. . .meh, I think there have always been second-rate 18 gold teams. There have always been Batbusters, Firecrackers, Sorcerers, ect as well. If you check rosters, you'll see that a lot of those awesome HS teams have players from the awesome TB teams.

It's the kids that are getting better. HS and TB are just where they go to play.

-W

 

[Lenski]

Here in SW Ohio there are a few HS teams that could beat good travel teams but for the most part TB exceeds HS ball in our area. Most HS teams here have rec kids or even kids that do not even play rec but play HS ball. On our HS team we have five TB kids that play but only three play on good TB teams. Luckily for us, both of our pitchers and our catcher play on good TB teams.

 

[maksoftball]

Meh...I don't think so. We still have 3-4 high schools who don't have any TB players feeding into their HS teams (however, could be that there are not enough so the TB players don't bother? I really have no idea). I do know that HS sports around here are extremely competitive. If you don't play outside of school, your chances of making team are slim to none (unless you are extremely athletic). DD wants to tryout for VB in the Fall as a Freshman; the coach requires ALL girls trying out to fill out a form...at least 2-3 questions ask what club they are playing with...as if that is a requirement. DD isn't playing club volleyball (can't afford it with TB too!) but she plays pretty good VB.

Anyway, a lot of TB teams for HS aged girls take breaks in the Spring while the girls play HS ball...good news is that they get quite a workout at HS (at least DD's does). I don't think this makes the TB teams getting worse as they do get good workouts; however, I think it depends on whether the teams still meet outside of HS ball. Also, I think there are rules set by some HS's where girls are not allowed to play with their TB team while HS season is in play.

 

[CoogansBluff]

My observation about the proliferation of TB teams and the subsequent dilution of talent:

I've noticed something odd...the HS teams are getting *better* than most of the TB teams in Chicagoland. It seems that a few powerhouse TB teams are attracting most of the high caliber TB players. As a result, the remaining TB teams that don't even have one outstanding player.

On the other hand, everyone on the HS teams play TB due to the large number of TB teams out there, and the HS teams all have at least one or two players from the powerhouse TB teams. The result is that the HS teams, by and large, could beat most of the TB teams.

E.g., Benet Academy (an excellent private school in the western burbs of Chicagoland) has a kid going to Georgia (SEC), one going to Illinois (Big 10), one going to Providence (Big 8), one going to Northwestern (Big 10) and one going to Georgia Southern (Sun Belt). There aren't many TB teams outside of the PAC 10 with five players going D1. I suspect that Benet could give a number of the upper echelon TB teams a good game.

Good subject.

I've always argued that ''the proliferation of TB teams and the subsequent dilution of talent'' is a good thing, especially in its effect on high school softball. While ''the proliferation'' might make it hard for the best TB teams to get all the top players and compete nationally, and it might lead to a bunch of not-so-good teams, this proliferation is good for the sport overall and for HS ball in particular. My daughter's middle school team has seven travel players, and while some play low-end travel, they're still much better than most rec players. If the ASA wants the sport to grow, it will want more kids playing travel ball.

As for the strength of high school ball, I certainly believe that the top teams in the state are better than than average travel team for the reasons that you stated. There are more travel teams now, and the 'average TB team' is not that great. Having lived in a county with 18 high schools, I'd say the top three teams would be very good travel teams. Not elite, but very good. Another 3-4 would be average TB teams. About 6 would be low-end travel teams. The bottom 6 would be rec teams at best, and a couple might not even field a team for lack of interest/experience.

re: Benet Academy - In some private schools, you have a tradition of being outstanding in a particular sport, and those parents of elite softball players want their kids to play on that kind of team. So while that team you describe is impressive, I wouldn't think that just happens at random. It's much harder for a public school to have a team that is better than an average travel team.

 

[CoogansBluff]

One other point - The desire to play high school ball might be one of the main reasons that we're seeing a proliferation of travel teams. Kids are recognizing early that to make many high school teams, they must play their sport year-round.

 

[Jackel2168]

We had this discussion as a coaching staff. High School ball is more pure because you no longer have to manage a clock, but most HS teams out here could be beaten by a well constructed travel team. We also have noticed that kids coming in from rec leagues do not have the fundamentals they used to. What the proliferation of TB players and coaches has done is taken coaches who would be very good at the rec ball level giving instruction and brought them to the TB level where they may be good coaches, but they just don't have the horses.

 

[coachtucc]

The problem might be that there are getting to be too many travel teams. Travel ball used to be a privlidge to play on. Now if a daughter doesn't make a team, the dad will create a team. Now I am not disparaging that or the dad who does that for his daughter, but to me travel ball is for girls to want to play in college and its not for those who want to play for fun. Just my opinion folks

 

[coach james]

Great thread... when I first started reading I thought you were crazy. There is no way a HS team could beat a quality travel team. But after reading the post completely, it makes a lot of since. I can't speak for Chicago area, but around here in eastern Indiana, HS ball is still inferior to 95% of TB teams. Especially when guys volunteer themselves to be an asst. coach just to continue the daddy ball game, and stick his dd on starting varsity when in all honesty she should probably be a reserve on jv.