Opinions on attacking the lead elbow

[Chris O'Leary]

No - it isn't. In fact - he is not even close...that's why he has to over turn. His shoulder driven barrel path is off plane and he knows it. Why in the world is there this much loop on a high tee?

See any loop here?

How about here?

If that was a real pitch at that height he wouldn't have a chance...

The idea that a loop in the swing -- the barrel falling below the hands -- is bad is a myth.

Every single hitter -- even the FP hitter in the clip above who is hitting a ball at her eyes -- has a loop in their swing.

You could argue that the persistence of myths like this is due to not using video, but that doesn't explain why Tony Gwynn -- who (supposedly?) looked at thousands of hours of video during his career -- still believes in this myth.

P.S. Check out the big old loop in Tony Gwynn's swing.

This guy's never going to be able to hit a lick.

 

[Chris O'Leary]

Big old loop here.

And this ball was up.

 

[RayR]

Who are trying to convince? Me or you?

 

[ArmWhip]

Here is a link on this topic. I don't know anything about the author.

The swing

 

[Chris O'Leary]

Who are trying to convince? Me or you?

Anyone who may be reading this.

Anyone who still believes that looping is a problem, despite all of the great video that's out there, can't be saved.

I cut Tony Gwynn some slack because he may have been working off of blurry video and couldn't see exactly what his barrel was doing, but that's not a problem with modern video.

Every good hitter has a loop in their swing.

 

[RayR]

Every good hitter has a loop in their swing.

Another classic line...

When you figure out the difference between looking at a 2D swing plane and loop - let me know...

 

[ArmWhip]

Reading this paper made my head spin but this caught my attention.

The large negative couple applied late in the swing is not
only counterintuitive, but appears to be inconsistent with the
action of the arms shown in Fig. 7. From the direction of
motion of the arms during the interval 300–380 ms in Fig. 7,
it appears that the left forearm is pulling on the handle and
the right forearm is pushing, as if the batter is deliberately
attempting to increase the angular velocity of the bat. However,
this interpretation is not consistent with the experimental
data. The largest torque component on the bat is due to
the centripetal force. By itself, that torque component would
cause the bat to rotate much more rapidly than it actually
does, with the result that the bat would rotate through an
excessive angle by the time it arrives at the impact point. If
the bat were allowed to rotate at such a high speed, the
handle would push firmly on the batter’s left hand and tend
to pull out of his right hand. The reaction force exerted by
the batter is such that the left hand pushes on the handle and
the right hand pulls on the handle, thereby generating the
large negative couple that restricts the total torque on the bat
to a value less than 6 Nm throughout the swing.

"The reaction force is such that the left hand pushes on the handle and the right hand pulls on the handle thereby generating the large negative couple....."

Sounds like 'holding the hinge angle' to me.

 

[Chris O'Leary]

Another classic line...

When you figure out the difference between looking at a 2D swing plane and loop - let me know...

Please describe your understanding of what a loop is.

How does it differ from what Gwynn describes?

 

[RayR]

Read this - try this on a bat

From the initial positions of the arms in Fig. 7 it might
appear that the left arm is pulling and the right arm is pushing
on the handle, because the handle is rotating counterclockwise.
However, the bat center of mass moves in the
opposite direction to the handle end during the initial part of
the swing, so the net transverse force on the handle must act
in the opposite direction to the direction of motion of the handle. Both arms therefore pull in opposite directions on the
handle, the right arm exerting a greater pull force than the
left arm.

 

[RayR]

Your son's barrel is not in plane and his hands make a late adjustment to get on plane and the barrel loops into contact. It is the same thing when a kid drops their hands and tries to catch up to a high fastball. In your son's case it is because he is relying on a shoulder move and it throws him off plane.

Please describe your understanding of what a loop is.

How does it differ from what Gwynn describes?