Extension - Hips before Hands

[Tewks]

Would you agree with this concept of extension: "hit the ball as long as possible and extend through the hitting area after contact"

Depends on the swing being employed..... I understand the cue, but it could just reinforce pushing through contact. If you are whipping through contact, then its a non-issue. Actually, if you are whipping through contact, you can't help it. Objectively, I personally don't like the cue of hitting the ball as long as possible. But sometimes it can work well with a player. You never know what will make a player get it. Sometimes its the upstream stuff, sometimes the downstream stuff. I think the more you teach a player, the more their knowledge base gets, the further upstream you can go and the more they will understand why upstream is the most important. (To me, downstream is all band aids.)

 

[softballphreak]

Path to contact vs path after contact....

Is the path to contact forced? Is the path after contact forced?


Elliptical path vs circular path....

What is the path around? How does pitch location effect the look? How do mechanics effect what is actually happening?

The path to and through would, of course, be the result of force. It won't get there without some kind of force.

For the sake of simplicity, let's assume a pitch down the middle. That would be the purest elliptical path. That path would deviate based on inside or outside pitches.

 

[RayR]

Would the front elbow path be upstream or downstream? Whenever I show a student how the elbow should travel - the swing path makes a major improvement.

Inside Pitch

Outside Pitch

High Pitch

 

[Tewks]

Depends what you believe. I'd say downstream.... pretty far.

 

[Chris O'Leary]

CO, extension is, or should be, a “result”. IMO, many instructors that have their hitters focus on extension, do so at the detriment to their hitters. When a hitter focuses on achieving a particular degree of extension, they often force the last instant, sudden effort, mentioned in the above post … exactly what you don’t want.

Consider extension to be an instructor’s tool in terms of collecting feedback on mechanics further upstream. It is the mechanics further upstream that impact extension. In other words, extension should be the result of earlier upstream mechanics, and not something achieved by an active last moment push.

That's what I said.

Please don't quote me back to me.

 

[Chris O'Leary]

Would you agree with this concept of extension: "hit the ball as long as possible and extend through the hitting area after contact"

I think extension is a no-teach but it can be an effective diagnostic tool because a lack of extension can pinpoint a number of problems.

While Charley Lau Sr. teaches that it has to do with what happens at contact, this isn't true. In truth, the bat and ball are in contact for just a moment.

 

[RayR]

Depends what you believe. I'd say downstream.... pretty far.

When we talk of exchanging elbows, turning the triangle, elbow jut, etc - are these downstream or upstream. I believe that they are more upstream because as a hitter you need to figure out how to move to allow this to happen naturally.

Put another way - do the hands working properly result in the front elbow path or does the front elbow path keep the hands inside?

I really like this swing and use her as a model.

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

I think extension is a no-teach but it can be an effective diagnostic tool because a lack of extension can pinpoint a number of problems.

Now you are getting it.

Extension should simply be thought of as a useful aid for the instructor. The actions that influence extension are upstream and should be the target of the instructors focus ... extension is merely the 'result'.

Further, those that have a hitter focus on 'extension' often end up having a hitter make a last ditch pushing effort ... not what we want.

 

[Tewks]

When we talk of exchanging elbows, turning the triangle, elbow jut, etc - are these downstream or upstream. I believe that they are more upstream because as a hitter you need to figure out how to move to allow this to happen naturally.

Put another way - do the hands working properly result in the front elbow path or does the front elbow path keep the hands inside?

I really like this swing and use her as a model.

Do the "elbows exchange the elbows" or does something else cause this? Do you turn the triangle or does the triangle get turned? The phrase "hips and hands" is used so often, but so rarely taught effectively. What do the hips and hands do? How does the body prepare for the hips and hands to be used?

What is upstream and what is downstream?


Any idea if the pitch is an off-speed mistake up? Or a rise?

 

[tom.guerry]

Type of "release" is intimately involved in the definition of "extension" and is derived from other more upstream actions, such as "connection"

"connection" is upstream from "extension".

Recently hitting internet crazies seem to like "the move" in spite of the fact the move "concept" comes from golfers.

Hpw does "the move" relate to the "action" of "connection" ?

what is upstream of "connection" ?

Here is a recent "move" discussion:

- RELEASE THE MOVE