Umpire not calling the game by the rules and no protests

[RJK]

The parents aren't paying the umpires directly and are not "customers" of the umpire. A poor way of looking at it and part of the problem...

Kind of like if you worked at a Ice Cream shop and a parent came in with their kid. They are not paying your wages directly, the shop owner does. But they are still the customer. Without the kids, there is no youth softball, and without their parents paying for them to play, there is no umpires getting paid.

 

[_MIA_]

Umpires act like they're the only industry that gets screamed at their job. Try working retail or the restaurant industry.

Right but if we are talking about a reason for the shortage, as mentioned this is a second job for most which isn't true for
those in the restaurant industry (or most any other job where verbal abuse is an issue..). MLB umps get screamed at from the stands all the time but that is their primary job...

 

[RJK]

How did you handle it? You asked how you should have handled it - so if you didn't do the below, well, the umpire might be at fault for not being a good umpire, but you are also contributing.

• At the plate meeting, did you accept their incorrect lineup and not point it out to the umpire and insist t it get corrected before play?
• When you became aware of 'batting out of order' did you go out to discuss with the umpire. You should become aware of batting out of order when your scorer or someone on your staff/team points it out to you (smart coaches only go out to discuss when it is to their advantage). This is not a place for the umpire to police (especially at this level)
  • Do you know what happens when you don't bring it to the umpires attention? Here you go - next pitch legitimizes the batter and the order goes from that hitter forward as on the lineup. Did that happen? Do you know what happened?
• When it happened again did you go out to discuss. Again, batting out of order is on the offensive coach to alert the umpire.
• If you went out, did you, the umpire and likely the other coach discuss the order of batters while reviewing the line up, who should have been up, etc. Were scorebooks referenced? Was an agreement made on whether the right batter is or was up? No one leaves that discussion until there is.
• When you went out to discuss the 'look back rule violation' (not circle violation - there is no such thing), why did you walk away. Why are you not there, asking why there is no out and saying the lineup issue has no bearing on this?
• When he sent the runner back to 2nd, did you go out immediately and say "My understanding is that the penalty for a 'look back violation' is an out, not returning the runner to the base. Is that correct? If you disagree, can you check with your partner to make sure as I am certain this is the penalty". Why did you wait until between innings.
• Was there a second umpire? What were they doing? Were they involved. You can absolutely ask for them to confer to discuss a point of rule.
• You might not be able to 'protest' but there has to be someone in charge. Where are they in all this?

So there you go. How as a coach I would handle it. Calm, collected and insistent. At some point maybe you just decide it is just a bad umpire and you play on, but if you haven't done the above then it is also on you.


You at least once walked off in a snit and accused him (probably quite correctly) of making rules up.

• I did accept the line up so ill accept that. Lesson learned.
• Of course I discuessed it when it happened. The runner happened to get on base which is why I discussed it. And yes I know what happens if I dont bring it up at the time it happens.
• Of course i went back out to discuss.
• Yes we reviewed and and the other coach admitted they batted out of order. I write down on happens on the line up card for reference next time they are up to bat. Its how I picked up on it.
• I walked away because the ump demanded the game moves on and told me to go back to the dugout. There wasnt another umpire to reference. Obviously I tried to tell him my understanding of the rule. I gave up on it and went back to the dugout. But i still wanted to know why so thats why I asked him inbetween innings.
• I could have had an assistant get the tournament director but I weighed the pros and cons quickly in the moment, the fact that we were winning at the time and said forget it. It wasn't worth arguing with a tree.
• But I still wanted to know his thought process which is why I asked him in between innings. That was when I accuesd him of making up rules to which he told me to walk away. And i did because I made my point.

Ill add that it was his last game of the day and he was probably ready to go home.

I appreciate the advice. This wasn't meant to turn into a umpire debate. Just how to deal with a bad umpire.

 

[RADcatcher]

as mentioned this is a second job for most

which isn't true for
those in the restaurant industry

Have to disagree with that comment.

 

[_MIA_]

Have to disagree with that comment.

Of course you do

I think you said you worked that industry so you would know better than me but around here (and granted I am in a college town) 1/2 the workers are 20 something’s and while it might not be their chosen career it is their only job..

 

[RJK]

Of course you do

Lot of people in the restaurant industry use it as a second job. I would know. I used to be one of them

 

[_MIA_]

Lot of people in the restaurant industry use it as a second job. I would know. I used to be one of them

See my edit..I will admit when I could be wrong..

That said I am not sure why anybody would want to die on a hill that consists of verbal abuse..

 

[RJK]

I posted before I saw the edit

Im never an advocate for verbally abusing umpires. Its never ok.

I am an advocate for umpires calling games by the rules and not giving freebees in tournaments because they feel bad or have some vendetta.

 

[_MIA_]

I am an advocate for umpires calling games by the rules and not giving freebees in tournaments because they feel bad or have some vendetta.

agree. I am just addressing the shortage issue.

Hell somebody might be fine with the abuse but they then cannot turn around and act like they don’t understand why there are not umpires..

 

[El Oso]

Supposed to arrive an hour early

Arrive an hour early. Jesus H man come on. Find me an ump that doesn't get hyperbolic in these discussions please! Can't take any of this serious with these exaggerations being thrown around.