Size of players relative to performance

[MNDad]

Not sure I follow you here.

While your statement is true when playing league and tournament ball with the alphabet sanctioning bodies, it isn't true when they start playing in High School and College. IMO, this is when it counts.

The later birthdays will play with the majority of the kids one calendar year later than them. i.e. Late 2000 birthdays are in 7th grade currently and will play mostly with 2001 birthdays in HS and College because of grade level.

Here was my thoughts. A 2015 with post January birthday is 16U. Girls in their class with Sept through Dec birthday's are now 18U and have been playing up a level facing stronger competetion. I see this as an advantage. They'll also get two years at 18U helping prepare for college while girls with post January birthdays will only get one. (If they play with their appointed age levels). Another advantage it would seem.

DD is a May bday so if early or late birthday is the deciding factor we're screwed either way.

 

[SoCal_Dad]

I've always felt later birthdates help in softball because girls born in Sept to December play up an age level compared to other girls in their grades through their youth.

Depends on the state - CA uses Dec 1 for their kindergarten cutoff.

Grade is only important when it comes to college recruiting because they go by grad class. It is a small factor in HS because they're competing against all HSers, not just their grade.

The birthdate's effect at the early ages (e.g. 8U-10U) affects the make up of the pool of players later on. My DD has a June birthdate and was one of the youngest on her TB team 12U-14U - only a couple girls had birthdates after her. At least 12 of those 13 will be playing sports in college on an athletic scholarship.

 

[GunnerShotgun]

I see this as an advantage. They'll also get two years at 18U helping prepare for college while girls with post January birthdays will only get one. (If they play with their appointed age levels). Another advantage it would seem.

It depends on what your goals are I suppose. The early birthdays will benefit in travel, the late birthdays will benefit in school ball (in theory).

The problem with discussing the height of girls playing D1 ball is the selection bias built in by the coaches.

Also, taller is only faster when all other things are equal in the system. No two systems (or girls) are similar that's why you can't conclusively say that taller is always faster.

People believe what they want, facts be damned...

 

[Bart Bouse]

As said before, this is interesting and I'm enjoying the comments. If we answered the question simply, the answer would be YES, YES, and YES. But, we have all attempted to answer the unasked which is: Should there be a bias on size? The consensus seems to be that there should not be. I agree, but with reservations. Be reminded, I have very short daughters. I've seen my daughter, a pitcher with some experience, go to an OU summer camp and because of her short stature be split into a group of small largely mediocre players but a taller girl from my same team who had no pitching experience, but told the camp she wanted to pitch, be directed to a group of larger, older, and better players. There was no tryout, they were simply divided by size. I'm in the middle of The Sports Gene by David Epstein. At least initially in the book, he indicates that much research would indicate that the physical characteristics that might foretell a potential elite athlete are superior eyesight and speed. The conclusion of much research is that 20/10 or better eyesight and those athletes with the most speed are most likely to become elite athletes. Most MLB players have 20/12 or better vision. He also points to Australia's success in creating world champion olympians in 14 months in a sport that participants had never played simply by finding the fastest athletes through a series of speed tests. If we throw out the current bias for large pitchers in softball, it seems hard to argue that speed is far more important than anything else. I know that the two best players I've had in the last 6 years were also, by far, the fastest girls I ever had. Both are still winning track meets with there speed. One could come away with the conclusion that if you wanted an elite softball team, round up all the 8 years olds in your locality and test each for eyesight and speed. Select the top in each category then par it down to 12 or 13 girls and keep them together for the next ten years. It would be an interesting experiment. One, I'm guessing, would result in a hugely successful softball team.

 

[Greenmonsters]

The problem with discussing the height of girls playing D1 ball is the selection bias built in by the coaches. .... People believe what they want, facts be damned...

Another problem, the "facts' aren't factual. The heights listed on a team's published roster most often are exaggerated by a minimum of 1-2 inches. This just serves to feed/further the bias. And its not just college SB! Do you think the NFL combines have to measure and weigh the players because the players don't know themselves?

 

[MNDad]

Grade is only important when it comes to college recruiting because they go by grad class. It is a small factor in HS because they're competing against all HSers, not just their grade.

You are correct. I should have clarified I was talking about the recruting. A 2015 girl with a May bday could be considered at a disadvantage, but only to other 2015 kids with fall/winter birthday's.

I wasn't even thinking HS ball except for the Grad year. It's easy to overlook because a good HS softball team here would be like a good HS hockey team by you.

 

[MsDinosaur]

But for players not as gifted athletically or at tall as these players, birth month may have been a factor in them being able to reach the highest levels of their sport. [/I]

Fascinating stuff. I read Gladwell's book and enjoyed it a lot.

My DD was born February 1st, a mediocre birthday for soccer where the cutoff is August?, but a great birthday for softball. She started playing both at a young age, but she wasn't nearly as strong a soccer player as a softball player. However, I don't know how much of that was due to birthdate and how much was due to body type...

 

[JJsqueeze]

and how much was due to soccer just sucking as a sport .....

 

[MsDinosaur]

I've always felt later birthdates help in softball because girls born in Sept to December play up an age level compared to other girls in their grades through their youth.

I would think that might help in later years, but first the girls need to stay with softball long enough for that to be a factor. Gladwell's point with hockey players is that early on in their careers, the older kids start out with an advantage and the younger players end up being weeded out before they really have a chance. Who knows how many younger girls decide they're not that crazy about softball (when the slightly more mature girls are getting more attention from the coaches and more reps at bat and at the more active fielding positions) and stop playing before they would even reach an age where they'd play up?

 

[SoCal_Dad]

Here was my thoughts. A 2015 with post January birthday is 16U. Girls in their class with Sept through Dec birthday's are now 18U and have been playing up a level facing stronger competetion. I see this as an advantage. They'll also get two years at 18U helping prepare for college while girls with post January birthdays will only get one. (If they play with their appointed age levels). Another advantage it would seem.

DD is a May bday so if early or late birthday is the deciding factor we're screwed either way.

Sorry, I missed this post because it occurred after I started my previous post. A player's birthdate has little effect on their ability at the older age groups - they've already survived due to the advantage or despite the disadvantage. Many/most of the top TB teams at the HS age groups are composed of multiple birthyears because they focus on playing ability rather than just birthyear. The top players only play 2, maybe 3, years combined at the 14U-16U level.

I wasn't even thinking HS ball except for the Grad year. It's easy to overlook because a good HS softball team here would be like a good HS hockey team by you.

Hey! lol