Base running rule?

[1fingeredknuckler]

Runners on 1st and 2nd, runner on 2nd breaks for 3rd , runner on 1st advances and occupies 2nd, runner that was on 2nd retreats to 2nd and both runners occupy 2nd, ss tags runner that tried to advance to 3rd, as he is occupying 2nd, then tags runner that advanced to 2nd from 1st, that is on 2nd . umpire calls runner out that was occupying 2nd that had advanced to 2nd from 1st, then ss tags runner that was on 2nd to begin with, that runner then leaves 2nd base and retreats to 1st base which he was not occupying when play started,

If you can understand that what is the call? Unless you saw the play also?

Then the runner that was on 2nd they let go to 1st, attempts to steal 2nd and is called out. I guess he had stole 2nd to start with so he could have stole 2nd safe twice in the same inning if he had been safe.

I did not make it up.

 

[Umpire]

You left out the most important element of the play - Was this a force play created by the batter becoming a batter-runner? It doesn't appear so, but the post also doesn't specify.

On a non-force play, R2 starting on 2nd base is entitled to 2nd base until she advances to 3rd base. Once at 3rd base, she no longer has the right to 2nd base. R1 starting on 1st base is not entitled to advance to 2nd base until R2 either reaches 3rd base or is tagged out. With both R1 and R2 standing on 2nd base and both being tagged, R1 is out because R2 still had a right to her original base.

On a force play, the ruling is completely different. There, R2 is forced to advance to 3rd base and R1 is forced to advance to 2nd base. Assuming the batter-runner has not been put out, if both R1 and R2 are standing on 2nd base and they are tagged (in this case the order doesn't matter since they are both in contact with the base), R2 is out and R1 is safe.

Mechanically, the umpire should point to the specific player that is being called out and if he can see her number, he ought to say, "Number 12 is out." This should look similar to old-school birddogging in basketball.

Obviously, you can't but R2 who started on 2nd base back on 1st base. If there was that much confusion on who was where, they should have called "time" and gotten the books out and got the call right.

 

[MTR]

Speaking ASA, assuming a stealing situation.

Runners on 1st and 2nd, runner on 2nd breaks for 3rd , runner on 1st advances and occupies 2nd, runner that was on 2nd retreats to 2nd and both runners occupy 2nd, ss tags runner that tried to advance to 3rd, as he is occupying 2nd, then tags runner that advanced to 2nd from 1st, that is on 2nd . umpire calls runner out that was occupying 2nd that had advanced to 2nd from 1st

R1 owns 2B until s/he advances to 3B. If both were touching 2B when each was tagged, the trailing runner (R2) should have been ruled out. Ball is still live

then ss tags runner that was on 2nd to begin with,

this act is meaningless as long as R1 is still in contact with the base

that runner then leaves 2nd base and retreats to 1st base which he was not occupying when play started,

Now it is getting weird

Then the runner that was on 2nd they let go to 1st, attempts to steal 2nd and is called out. I guess he had stole 2nd to start with so he could have stole 2nd safe twice in the same inning if he had been safe.

The defense actually let R1 go back to 1B during a live ball and did not make a play? Yep, weird it is. Question before I go any farther down this Third World path. Was this all continual action or did R1 station herself at 1B and the game continued with a pitch to the batter?

 

[1fingeredknuckler]

it was an attempted steal

sorry for the miss

 

[MTR]

it was an attempted steal

sorry for the miss

Wasn't my question. To be a "steal", it must occur during a pitch. Was there a pitch on the "attempted steal" or was this player just running back an forth?

 

[1fingeredknuckler]

Wasn't my question. To be a "steal", it must occur during a pitch. Was there a pitch on the "attempted steal" or was this player just running back an forth?

last statement
the runner attempted to steal, couldn't make it, caight in a pickle, runner on 1st had advanced to 2nd, they were then both occupying 2nd, runner from 1st was called out, runner that was on 2nd returned to first

that's the way it went down,

then that runner on 1st attempted to steal 2nd for the 2nd time in the inning was called out this time

----------------------------------------------------
i have the answer, just curious if any one else had ever seen this, i had not, and i probably won;t again

 

[MTR]

last statement
the runner attempted to steal, couldn't make it, caight in a pickle, runner on 1st had advanced to 2nd, they were then both occupying 2nd, runner from 1st was called out, runner that was on 2nd returned to first

that's the way it went down,

then that runner on 1st attempted to steal 2nd for the 2nd time in the inning was called out this time

----------------------------------------------------
i have the answer, just curious if any one else had ever seen this, i had not, and i probably won;t again

Simple question asking if there was another pitch and you cannot answer that?

That would actually make a difference, so I hope you have the right answer.

 

[1fingeredknuckler]

Simple question asking if there was another pitch and you cannot answer that?

That would actually make a difference, so I hope you have the right answer.

how could there be 2 pitches when the situation happened at the same time, i don't think there were 2 balls.

i just thought this would gather some thoughts, don't worry about it.

 

[MTR]

Read this:

runner that was on 2nd returned to first

that's the way it went down,

then that runner on 1st attempted to steal 2nd for the 2nd time in the inning was called out this time

Your comment placed the runner back on 1st. Then you interrupted your play with "that's the way it went down" and then continued with an attempt to steal 2nd. The definition of a "steal" requires a pitch and that is all I'm trying to determine.

If there was no pitch, there is no 2nd attempt to steal 2nd base a 2nd time, just one continuous play and the runner would be out.

If the ball was back in the circle, then leaving 1st base would have been a violation of the LBR. If there was a pitch, then there is a problem as the umpire should not have allowed that to happen.

You want discussion, but you weren't willing to offer the parameters that would create the cause for discussion. Geesh!

 

[1fingeredknuckler]

Read this:


Your comment placed the runner back on 1st. Then you interrupted your play with "that's the way it went down" and then continued with an attempt to steal 2nd. The definition of a "steal" requires a pitch and that is all I'm trying to determine.

If there was no pitch, there is no 2nd attempt to steal 2nd base a 2nd time, just one continuous play and the runner would be out.

If the ball was back in the circle, then leaving 1st base would have been a violation of the LBR. If there was a pitch, then there is a problem as the umpire should not have allowed that to happen.

You want discussion, but you weren't willing to offer the parameters that would create the cause for discussion. Geesh!

sorry you can't understand GEEESH