Swing down

[TDS]

I pretty much use the Barry Bonds drill as my go to teaching. It just fixes almost everything reactively. I was always able to hit the ball far but I was always guessing and never back side. When I learned it as simple as swinging down but maintaining posture / spine angle then it really opened up the whole field to me and I was able to adjust on off speed.

We so over complicate this. It is actually pretty funny. Swing straight down to the ball and turn. Hands stay linear while posture \ turning provide the nike swoosh. If you are under the ball you are not down to enough and if you are pounding the ball in the ground you are not turning enough. Pretty simple.

Yep !! Try to keep the bat working " down to" aligned with the posture.

 

[fanboi22]

I guess the question here is for everyone. The swing_design5 video resembles Williams swing below. In that the barrel is parallel to the ground in both. I know it is just an illustration, but the demonstration seems to match. Seems he is swinging a barrel that stays parallel to the ground. And then somehow swoops up at the back half of the swing. Kinda like an epstein video i saw that tries to demonstrate the 'v' swing in the barrel. down then back up like a shape of a v.

My question is, in any swing, what is the ideal bat angle to the ground? I suppose it would be from a pitchers standpoint looking at the batter and what that angle is \ vs - . Starting at a shoulder level pitch, my assumption is that the barrel will be relatively flat or parallel to the ground because if the hands are usually shoulder height (give or take), the swing would have to be level with shoulders and pitch.

As the pitch goes lower and lower, my assumption is that hitter would want to keep hands in plane with the shoulders as much as possible, and that the angle to the ground would increase. Middle pitch would be ~45degrees ish? (depending on height of batter as well. but assume a waist high pitch in any case.

Is that a correct assumption?

I feel if this doesn't happen you would have to squat more or bring hands down the torso farther. In doing this, the phrase on top and down to feel better, just that the bat will intersect the ball at an angle relative to the ground. Which is why i don't think aiming for the lower or middle or top of the ball is necessarily 'correct'. The up or down a ball would go would depend on the timing of when the impact occurs. Late, would hit down, and early would hit up.

 

[Eric F]

I guess the question here is for everyone. The swing_design5 video resembles Williams swing below. In that the barrel is parallel to the ground in both. I know it is just an illustration, but the demonstration seems to match. Seems he is swinging a barrel that stays parallel to the ground. And then somehow swoops up at the back half of the swing. Kinda like an epstein video i saw that tries to demonstrate the 'v' swing in the barrel. down then back up like a shape of a v.

My question is, in any swing, what is the ideal bat angle to the ground? I suppose it would be from a pitchers standpoint looking at the batter and what that angle is \ vs - . Starting at a shoulder level pitch, my assumption is that the barrel will be relatively flat or parallel to the ground because if the hands are usually shoulder height (give or take), the swing would have to be level with shoulders and pitch.

As the pitch goes lower and lower, my assumption is that hitter would want to keep hands in plane with the shoulders as much as possible, and that the angle to the ground would increase. Middle pitch would be ~45degrees ish? (depending on height of batter as well. but assume a waist high pitch in any case.

Is that a correct assumption?

I feel if this doesn't happen you would have to squat more or bring hands down the torso farther. In doing this, the phrase on top and down to feel better, just that the bat will intersect the ball at an angle relative to the ground. Which is why i don't think aiming for the lower or middle or top of the ball is necessarily 'correct'. The up or down a ball would go would depend on the timing of when the impact occurs. Late, would hit down, and early would hit up.



View attachment 22862

The video does not demonstrate the contact position found in a high-level swing. It's actually REALLY bad. Barrel tilt will match (or be close to) the angle of shoulder tilt.


These pics are from an analysis I was doing regarding body position over the rear hip, but they also shows the barrel alignment with the lead forearm at contact we see very typically in good swings.

 

[fanboi22]

The video does not demonstrate the contact position found in a high-level swing. It's actually REALLY bad. Barrel tilt will match (or be close to) the angle of shoulder tilt.


These pics are from an analysis I was doing regarding body position over the rear hip, but they also shows the barrel alignment with the lead forearm at contact we see very typically in good swings.
View attachment 22863
View attachment 22864

Thanks, so with that said, then is the 'swing down' feel more about taking the hands off the higher shoulder point and swinging down to because of the angle? i assume a high pitch will have less of a 'swing down to' feel.

 

[Eric F]

Thanks, so with that said, then is the 'swing down' feel more about taking the hands off the higher shoulder point and swinging down to because of the angle? i assume a high pitch will have less of a 'swing down to' feel.

I'm the wrong one to ask about that. I'm not a fan of the "swing down" idea the way it often gets presented. I agree that the hands should take a direct path from launch to contact, but I don't agree that the barrel follows the path of the hands.

 

[Shawn]

Eric

The barrel and spine/shoulder tilt and barrel position is measured in Blast. You want a 90 degree angle of the bat going off the posture tilt. It’s part of the connection metrics, 90 degree at launch and 90 degrees at contact. I scored high in both in the swings I posted.

 

[Shawn]

Yeah, whatever @Shawn was smoking when he wrote that..

Pattar, you can smoke all you want here in Washington, it’s legal. lol That emoji is what you look like afterwards.

 

[_MIA_]

Pattar, you can smoke all you want here in Washington, it’s legal. lol That emoji is what you look like afterwards.

Sounds like an admission to me..good for you man. I need some of that before I go watch Marcela play

 

[fanboi22]

I'm the wrong one to ask about that. I'm not a fan of the "swing down" idea the way it often gets presented. I agree that the hands should take a direct path from launch to contact, but I don't agree that the barrel follows the path of the hands.

Thanks, i guess i was asking everyone, just that it was a reply to you. Thanks for answering though.

I also agree, i dont like the way it is presented, which is why i am trying to figure out where the conversations are going.

I am curious about the bold above though. Don't mean to bring anything up that you may have already written, but just curious in what way the barrel doesn't follow. Do you mean the arc of the hands doesn't match the arc of the barrel? lag to whip? Thanks.

 

[Eric F]

I am curious about the bold above though. Don't mean to bring anything up that you may have already written, but just curious in what way the barrel doesn't follow. Do you mean the arc of the hands doesn't match the arc of the barrel? lag to whip? Thanks.

The hands take a direct path from launch to contact. The barrel of the bat rotates around that hand path. IMO, the turning of the barrel to contact is initiated by the hands torqueing the handle of the bat in a direction that is perpendicular to the rear forearm (hand pivot point). For the barrel to follow the path of the hands, the hands would pull the bat along its longitudinal axis. Although this has been demonstrated by some pros, it's not what I see happening in the game swings of those same pros.