Planetary Rotation

[sluggers]

So, I come to you asking how we can un-learn this habit and re-learn I/R, because there isn't a cue I've read for the lock-it-in drill that is working.

It is such a minor problem for her age, it is not worth worrying about it. It is more important to spend your time working on her arm circle, lower body, accuracy, etc. Like others have said, bullet spin is very common.

I would tell her to extend her arm to the target after release. You were want her arm and hand in the "magician finish".

 

[SJVCoachingDad]

I would tell her to extend her arm to the target after release. You were want her arm and hand in the "magician finish".

Thanks for the encouragement. Our next practice is in a few hours after she gets out of school. We're also working on that finish. Our joke is that she does glue it in instead of lock it in, in reference to her elbow not extending after ball release. I'll try the magician drill to help her feel this.

 

[sluggers]

Thanks for the encouragement. Our next practice is in a few hours after she gets out of school. We're also working on that finish. Our joke is that she does glue it in instead of lock it in, in reference to her elbow not extending after ball release. I'll try the magician drill to help her feel this.

Other descriptors of the hand position are "zombie hand" and "kiss the hand of the fair maiden" and "show the catcher your new fingernail polish".

 

[STRIKE3]

The follow-thru is a function of good mechanics upstream meaning IR, brush, whip, spin, etc. If those things are done the follow-thru that @sluggers mention will happen. It is not forced.

With that said, every pitcher should aspire to have the mechanics that produce the follow-thru of a Garcia, Ueno, Rick and Sarah Pauly, etc. etc.



S3

 

[STRIKE3]

 

[STRIKE3]

sorry to the OP. Didn't mean to steal this thread but agree with what @sluggers stated on the follow-thru. The above are examples of model pitchers and just a couple to look at and say why does that hand "flop" around extended at the end. Then backchain all the mechanics backward and you have a good place to start IMHO.

S3

 

[SJVCoachingDad]

sorry to the OP. Didn't mean to steal this thread but agree with what @sluggers stated on the follow-thru. The above are examples of model pitchers and just a couple to look at and say why does that hand "flop" around extended at the end. Then backchain all the mechanics backward and you have a good place to start IMHO.

S3

You didn't steal anything. This is how I've learned by going back and reading threads that are years old. We're trying very hard to get her to follow thru palm down. I joke with her that she does the "glue it in" instead of the lock it in. She does the motions good with lock it in, but back chaining to 9 o'clock and she wants to sidearm throw, "planetary spin," or roll the ball off her index finger because she can't get the whip.
I'm very grateful for all the replies and help. And will update this thread as she makes improvement...or as I need more coaching help.

 

[Hillhouse]

A brief background. I've been lurking the board and learning as much as I could for the last year or so. I've read and believe I understand the I/R in the Classroom sticky, seen Mike M's videos explaining more of the I/R. Last spring I taught my 10 year-old the basics of I/R pitching after she decided she wanted to pitch. Things went great. She progressed through all the drills and loved it. Around December we took a break because she had progressed to where she could reliably throw 6 out of 10 pitches over the plate with the 12/6 spin described in the I/R sticky.

She got sick in January, and we couldn't start warming her arm up for spring until mid-February. Out of nowhere she now throws the ball with what I can only describe as planetary spin or completely random wobble. We've been back at the lock-it-in drill for almost a month now and she cannot get her fingers down at release no matter what we try. So, I come to you asking how we can un-learn this habit and re-learn I/R, because there isn't a cue I've read for the lock-it-in drill that is working.

A brief background. I've been lurking the board and learning as much as I could for the last year or so. I've read and believe I understand the I/R in the Classroom sticky, seen Mike M's videos explaining more of the I/R. Last spring I taught my 10 year-old the basics of I/R pitching after she decided she wanted to pitch. Things went great. She progressed through all the drills and loved it. Around December we took a break because she had progressed to where she could reliably throw 6 out of 10 pitches over the plate with the 12/6 spin described in the I/R sticky.

She got sick in January, and we couldn't start warming her arm up for spring until mid-February. Out of nowhere she now throws the ball with what I can only describe as planetary spin or completely random wobble. We've been back at the lock-it-in drill for almost a month now and she cannot get her fingers down at release no matter what we try. So, I come to you asking how we can un-learn this habit and re-learn I/R, because there isn't a cue I've read for the lock-it-in drill that is working.

I'm probably deep in the minority here so take that for what it's worth. But, I firmly believe that when a pitcher twists the wrist, as the OP's kid is doing at the release of the ball giving it bullet like spin, the problem can often be tracked back to the elbow. Which is why, again probably in the minority of the experts, I do NOT like that drill in the OP's video. With all due respect to those who use this drill, I personally believe when someone has a wrist problem, it's usually the elbow. The more a pitcher whips their elbow, the less the wrist can twist and mess up the rotation. Whether throwing overhand or underhand, the kinetic chain of elbow, wrist then fingers when releasing the ball is the same. So, to fix the wrist, the elbow needs more whip, more exaggeration, a stronger follow through.

I know some will say bullet spin isn't bad. But, as someone who has not only pitched but stepped in the batters box against some of the world's fastest pitchers, I can tell you that none of them have bullet spin. Why? Because that requires the wrist to turn which breaks the natural whipping motion. This is also why a baseball pitcher's curveball is considerably slower than the fastball. The spin required (side spin) means they have to turn their wrist at release. A slider is faster than a typical curve but, still not as fast as the fastball. Moreover, bullet spin means the ball is not going to move. It's going to stay on the line of release. And in the batter's box, I would salivate if I knew someone not only threw pitches that didn't move but also gave me a target to hit, which is the dot in the middle of the ball when throwing bullet spin. Do you guys have any idea how many games I've pitched where I was getting shelled and in between some LONG innings I would say to the coach and catcher, "it's just not moving today". I cannot fathom doing that on purpose.

 

[Ken B]

I was under the impression that if her thumb could not reach the stitching along the black stripe that its better for her thumb to be off the stripe and on the stitching as close to the stripe as she can get it.

/\ This /\

 

[wheresmycar]

We're trying very hard to get her to follow thru palm down.

This is wrong approach. You will end up with a forced palm down, which is no more useful than a high elbow finish. Palm down finish is a natural result of internal rotation for SOME pitchers.... Coaching palm down finish is same as coaching high elbow finish in my book... useless in best case... detrimental in worst case. Let her finish naturally, and focus on what actually influences the ball, before release.