Velocity vs accuracy

[radness]

Live in FL and DD is 55-57, we play the better tournaments in 16U in FL, GA, and AL. She is average to a little below average as far as speed.

Spins it and locates. Has some good JUCO offers as a Junior but definitely not in the rare compartment as far as speed.

what is her favorite two pitch combo to throw? AKA something she likes to throw back to back?

 

[Tango]

what is her favorite two pitch combo to throw? AKA something she likes to throw back to back?

Really according to which day and hitter. Curve on either side of the plate is normally automatic. Of course some days better than others. Change is very good. Drop best pitch when on but not as consistent as the other two. When on drop inside and change outside is tuff.

 

[LEsoftballdad]

Yet 67mph happens at 16.
Mid 60's is common at premier nationals.
_______________________
Like seeing people are discussing actual mph #'s because this is what distinguishes velocity from common speeds.

Teams/Players that are commonly seeing pitchers who throw at higher velocities are not blown away by them come Nationals. They become accustomed to that and timing is just timing regardless of the speed of pitch. Velocity, in of itself, once a batter has timing, is not enough.

This is where teams that know they are going to be facing faster pitching prepare by turning up their hitting machines at practice.

Okay, let me rephrase my statement. Throwing 67 with any kind of regularity and movement at 16 is exceedingly rare, if it happens at all. Can girls hit that speed? I suppose, but again, it's rare, even at Nationals. I see a lot of people claim to have seen it, but a lot of the radar guns could be grandpa radar.

Full disclosure: my daughter has hit 64 in practice on the Pocket Radar a grand total of two times. Neither of them were strikes, so while I have that as her top speed, I always preface it by saying "She's hit 64 on the PR." In games, she lives between 60-62, with the occasional 63 on her riseball. Even her 63 is rare, probably 3-4 per game. She plays for a National 16U team, so we see a lot of top competition.

I've caught my Jugs machine as fast as it goes, which is 70 MPH from 43 feet. I nearly soiled myself because it looks like it was shot out of a gun. The fastest ball I ever caught was a 91 MPH fastball in a summer league in college. I was *not* a catcher, but I agreed to warm up a pitcher before a game. This kid could throw a 12-6 curve that made the fastball look even faster. After that experience, I went back to playing RF.

 

[LEsoftballdad]

Edit: I've seen a few posts on SM from some trainers who have girls post speeds at or near 70 MPH, but they were always on what they called a run through. Maybe one of our esteemed scientists can tell us how running full speed then releasing a pitch would impact the overall speed.

 

[Vertigo]

Edit: I've seen a few posts on SM from some trainers who have girls post speeds at or near 70 MPH, but they were always on what they called a run through. Maybe one of our esteemed scientists can tell us how running full speed then releasing a pitch would impact the overall speed.

So just going by baseball as my ds’ PC has him do “run and guns.”What they are supposed to teach is the feel for explosive arm whip while “hitting the breaks hard” while using FSR. Once they get the feel from that and can reproduce the whip they feel from the run through it’s supposed to translate to the mound.

 

[radness]

Okay, let me rephrase my statement. Throwing 67 with any kind of regularity and movement at 16 is exceedingly rare, if it happens at all. Can girls hit that speed?

Seriuosly yes players can hit that speed!
can go to alliance pgf Nationals and other showcase tournaments and see it.
*But I agree that 67 would be considered high velocity at age 16.
65 not so much.

Full disclosure: my daughter has hit 64 in practice on the Pocket Radar a grand total of two times. Neither of them were strikes, so while I have that as her top speed, I always preface it by saying "She's hit 64 on the PR." In games, she lives between 60-62, with the occasional 63 on her riseball. Even her 63 is rare, probably 3-4 per game. She plays for a National 16U team, so we see a lot of top competition.

I've caught my Jugs machine as fast as it goes, which is 70 MPH from 43 feet. I nearly soiled myself because it looks like it was shot out of a gun. The fastest ball I ever caught was a 91 MPH fastball in a summer league in college. I was *not* a catcher, but I agreed to warm up a pitcher before a game. This kid could throw a 12-6 curve that made the fastball look even faster. After that experience, I went back to playing RF.

Just to be clear I am not debating any of your comments...simply commenting to identify what is actually considered high velocity.

Even if it is rare or not it is still part of the game!
? What % is rare in your coments
Say 10% or ????
Top tier teams = 10%???

Example
Players in the last sat & sun at 16,18's Premier Nationals are definitely seeing velocity on a regular basis throughout their seasons.
Point being ,
65 mph is hitting practice without
mixing speeds and control of locations.

 

[radness]

Okay, let me rephrase my statement. Throwing 67 with any kind of regularity and movement at 16 is exceedingly rare, if it happens at all. Can girls hit that speed? I suppose, but again, it's rare, even at Nationals. I see a lot of people claim to have seen it, but a lot of the radar guns could be grandpa radar.

Full disclosure: my daughter has hit 64 in practice on the Pocket Radar a grand total of two times. Neither of them were strikes, so while I have that as her top speed, I always preface it by saying "She's hit 64 on the PR." In games, she lives between 60-62, with the occasional 63 on her riseball. Even her 63 is rare, probably 3-4 per game. She plays for a National 16U team, so we see a lot of top competition.

I've caught my Jugs machine as fast as it goes, which is 70 MPH from 43 feet. I nearly soiled myself because it looks like it was shot out of a gun. The fastest ball I ever caught was a 91 MPH fastball in a summer league in college. I was *not* a catcher, but I agreed to warm up a pitcher before a game. This kid could throw a 12-6 curve that made the fastball look even faster. After that experience, I went back to playing RF.

I caught for Michelle Granger throwing from 40 feet who was clocked consistently 70 mph
71-72 would pipe in zzzippppp.

Yep reaction time is fragmented at that speed and close distance.

 

[Tazman]

This generally seems about right to me. At the regional level at 16s, have not seen many girls consistently delivering the ball in the low 60s. Also agree that certainly by 16s that even that velocity—which is coming in pretty hot—won’t scare anybody unless it is really well located and/or has good movement. Flat and fat and it is out of there. You have more margin for error if you are throwing hard, but not that much against good

Alright like seeing a breakdown.

i would include mixing speed in *top tier 10u and mixing with location in *top tear 12u.

Are those averages speeds?
Looks like some average in there?!
What is high velocity then?
Some top 12u pitchers are already throwing 60-61 = high velocity
( the pitchers I'm referring to high velocity had just turned 13 and were finishing their last summers in 12u)




70+ mph is what i consider high velocity for college.

What I posted is what I'd consider fast for the age level. Spit balling but maybe top 10% for the age group at A level and where the velocity itself has impact complementing the other tools. There are faster pitchers than this but those are relatively rare outside of national tournaments where the top 10% cluster and maybe there you could add 2-3 mph for high velocity at the upper ages and maybe as much as 4-6 at the lower ages. I'm also talking pocket radar timed game speed not slinging it for numbers.

 

[Tazman]

Seriuosly yes players can hit that speed!
can go to alliance pgf Nationals and other showcase tournaments and see it.
*But I agree that 67 would be considered high velocity at age 16.
65 not so much.

Just to be clear I am not debating any of your comments...simply commenting to identify what is actually considered high velocity.

Even if it is rare or not it is still part of the game!
? What % is rare in your coments
Say 10% or ????
Top tier teams = 10%???

Example
Players in the last sat & sun at 16,18's Premier Nationals are definitely seeing velocity on a regular basis throughout their seasons.
Point being ,
65 mph is hitting practice without
mixing speeds and control of locations.

Rad, most of the D1 softball I watch the pitchers are around 65 with the really elite ones at 68-72 when ESPN is not juicing the radar. The best high school pitcher I know of in Northern California is around 63 game speed. Where are all these 16U 67mph kids going or are they showing only spin, spot, mix progression from 16 through college? And are we talking the same top 10% A level defintionally? I'm out every weekend with a radar gun and just don't see these speeds that often outside of big regional or national level tournaments.

 

[radness]

Rad, most of the D1 softball I watch the pitchers are around 65

65 in D1 is hitting practice without location and mixing speeds would you agree?

with the really elite ones at 68-72

Ok that sentence acknowledges that there is a high velocity range and for you it starts at 68 okay!...
for me it starts at 70 (that's me as a batter.)

The best high school pitcher I know of in Northern California is around 63 game speed.

How old? Would say that is a common velocity.

Where are all these 16U 67mph kids going or are they showing only spin, spot, mix progression from 16 through college? And are we talking the same top 10% A level defintionally? I'm out every weekend with a radar gun and just don't see these speeds that often outside of big regional or national level tournaments.

Didnt say ALL these like theres 100...
Rather Differentiating what velocity is high not average.

Most every top tier pitcher is going to have to utilize control of location and mixing speeds because trying to get above 68 mph is a lesser percentage of pitcher that get to high velocity.
Even at high velocity for batters that have timing it's going to have to be at 70 mph Plus.

Simply pointing out that speed at 65 alone is not going to cut it with batters that already have timing.

(Btw I am also familiar with Northern California over the years, and there *have been pitchers that throw above 65 there.
Sorcerer's, LTG, Grappettes have had pitchers that throw with high velocity.
( not certain of their current rosters)