Opposite or same direction?

[RayR]

Made these 2 clips. I am swinging a sledge hammer (50lbs?).

In one clip I am pulling in the same direction and the other I am pulling in opposite directions.

Maybe someone cab gif these? When you slow them down they reveal an awful lot.

 

[Tewks]

I will make a synced GIF of these tomorrow when I get back to my PC.

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

Opp on left & Same on right.

 

[FiveFrameSwing]

Funny thing is .... that swing on the right representing the 'same direction', is exactly what I see with the lead elbow when kids 'push' with the top hand. Prefer the swing on the left.

 

[RayR]

push and pull get mixed up. Are you pulling the bat with the top hand or pushing? I think you are correct that most kids push with the top hand when they should be pulling up the bat towards the barrel. The bottom hand gets mixed up too. When the bat gets left behind (as in the rear elbow gets ahead) is the bottom hand pushing when it should be pulling?

Maybe it makes more sense to think of the hands as trying to pull the bat apart between the hands. Or that the top hand wants to slide up the bat and the bottom hand want to slide down the bat.

In the sledge hammer demo (funny I just listened to SledgeHammer by Peter Gabriel on Sirius...) when the hand pressure is in opposite directions it keeps the hammer head on its natural path and everything lines up at contact (the bucket).

When pulling in the same direction it looks quicker, but actually takes a frame longer to get to the contact and the hammer head is being pulled off line. There is also a flip of the wrists right after contact that looks awfully familiar in a lot of fastpitch swings.

There is more, but I want to see if anyone else sees it...

 

[cshilt]

There is more, but I want to see if anyone else sees it...

The head of the sledgehammer is being pulled up, or farther away from the ground.

 

[RayR]

I added some pauses to the clip.

 

[softballphreak]

How does the hand actions described compare to torquing the hands? In other words could it be called hand torque?

When does the hand action occur? At launch, just prior to ball contact, or when?

 

[RayR]

I don't know if I think of it as any real "torquing".

First, you want to establish the hand path.

In the sledge demo - the hand path is predeterimined because of the pendulum action of the hammer. So, it is easy to apply force in the opposite direction.

In a swing - IMO - you want to establish a hand path with a pull/pull hand pressure and as the hands arc the barrel will start turning to the naked eye. But, the actual force to get the turning started is from the oppo pressure at the start. If you pull/push to start a hand path the hands then need to apply a torquing to snap to the barrel around.

Depending on location the hand path may be more or less arcish and the barrel turning will start earlier or later.

 

[FPMark]

The video on the left seems much smother but the one on the right looks to have the head of the hammer in the " hit zone" longer. I'm looking at the hammer head in relation to the saw horses and your ankles.