Cost per game?

[The Man In Blue]

I have an unusual question for coaches (and non-coaches) for some informal research ...

When you enter tournaments, what is your "cost per game"? Calculate this two ways:

• Tournament entry fee(s) / minimum # of games guaranteed
• Tournament entry fee(s) / actual games played

(I know, actual costs are very different, but I just want to look at tournament fees.)

Bonus question: What factors do you account for when looking at the cost of a tournament?

 

[canyonjoe]

We always tried to find the right level first. Then a 5 game guarantee was important if it fit as we wanted to play more games. However the bigger factor is where the tournament is. Even at 600 a tournament it's only 50 a player to play but if you have to travel then if you can stay one night it's so much cheaper than 2 and 0 nights is even better.

 

[RADcatcher]

I have an unusual question for coaches (and non-coaches) for some informal research ...

When you enter tournaments, what is your "cost per game"? Calculate this two ways:

• Tournament entry fee(s) / minimum # of games guaranteed
• Tournament entry fee(s) / actual games played

(I know, actual costs are very different, but I just want to look at tournament fees.)

Bonus question: What factors do you account for when looking at the cost of a tournament?

Like this bonus question that's added because I think the cost per family attending tournaments should be considered in that cost per game evaluation.

 

[The Man In Blue]

Context: a local school has put in new fields and wants to see them get more use. An idea was brought to me about hosting some local tournaments. It isn’t a large town (but just outside of one), so we are talking one field (not a complex). My thought was host one-day tournaments with a 3-game round-robin and then seed them into 1st/2nd and 3rd/4th games (so 4 games per team, no more no less).

One thing I would want to do to give them an "edge" is to use 3-umpire crews. That brings up the price.

No gate fees.

This is why I am specifically asking about entry fees ONLY in the cost, but what other costs you consider.

 

[Gambler Bob]

Context: a local school has put in new fields and wants to see them get more use. An idea was brought to me about hosting some local tournaments. It isn’t a large town (but just outside of one), so we are talking one field (not a complex). My thought was host one-day tournaments with a 3-game round-robin and then seed them into 1st/2nd and 3rd/4th games (so 4 games per team, no more no less).

One thing I would want to do to give them an "edge" is to use 3-umpire crews. That brings up the price.

No gate fees.

This is why I am specifically asking about entry fees ONLY in the cost, but what other costs you consider.

3 umpire crews are unnecessary IMO. Especially for a one day tournament with no real big winner of anything. Not worth the extra cost.

 

[The Man In Blue]

I'm biased as an umpire, but I think there is tremendous value. I'll admit more bias as I've recently had multiple conversations with umpires discussing how crews are expected to magically work 3UC at higher levels but are not provided any opportunity to do so until they show up on the doorstep. Further reinforced from a coach who made a comment this past weekend to me that he would pay more for a tournament with 3UC.

When I was down South, I started working "higher" levels of games for organizations that were trying to put on actual quality experiences, not cram as many entry fees onto fields as they could. This was the start of this little itch in the back of my brain since I've come back to the Midwest.

Don't take offense to this @Gambler Bob , but teams that are just looking to win something are not the teams I would be marketing this towards. I am conceptually thinking it is more aimed at older age groups who aren't plastic-hunting.

Or, I may be totally off base and there is not a demand for a quality playing experience.

 

[Josh Greer]

I'm biased as an umpire, but I think there is tremendous value. I'll admit more bias as I've recently had multiple conversations with umpires discussing how crews are expected to magically work 3UC at higher levels but are not provided any opportunity to do so until they show up on the doorstep. Further reinforced from a coach who made a comment this past weekend to me that he would pay more for a tournament with 3UC.

When I was down South, I started working "higher" levels of games for organizations that were trying to put on actual quality experiences, not cram as many entry fees onto fields as they could. This was the start of this little itch in the back of my brain since I've come back to the Midwest.

Don't take offense to this @Gambler Bob , but teams that are just looking to win something are not the teams I would be marketing this towards. I am conceptually thinking it is more aimed at older age groups who aren't plastic-hunting.

Or, I may be totally off base and there is not a demand for a quality playing experience.

Around here (between KC and St Louis) it's not uncommon to play pool with 1 to 2 umps, and 3 for bracket.

 

[YoungBuck]

I'm biased as an umpire, but I think there is tremendous value. I'll admit more bias as I've recently had multiple conversations with umpires discussing how crews are expected to magically work 3UC at higher levels but are not provided any opportunity to do so until they show up on the doorstep. Further reinforced from a coach who made a comment this past weekend to me that he would pay more for a tournament with 3UC.

When I was down South, I started working "higher" levels of games for organizations that were trying to put on actual quality experiences, not cram as many entry fees onto fields as they could. This was the start of this little itch in the back of my brain since I've come back to the Midwest.

Don't take offense to this @Gambler Bob , but teams that are just looking to win something are not the teams I would be marketing this towards. I am conceptually thinking it is more aimed at older age groups who aren't plastic-hunting.

Or, I may be totally off base and there is not a demand for a quality playing experience.

There's definitely a market for more value.

And it doesn't have to come at higher costs. Families, coaches, and teams will eventually reach a tipping point where these travel events are not worth the costs. I think you can make the argument that very few families get value out of travel softball. I'm not suggesting they shouldn't play softball, just that there could be better options available.

In many states you're seeing alternatives turn up for another option to the typical travel experience.

 

[The Man In Blue]

@YoungBuck ... what are some of the alternatives you've seen popping up?

Since my daughter finished playing a long time ago, I'm out of the loop on this stuff. As an umpire, I show up and work the field they tell me to. I know nothing about how the brackets or tournament is set up (beyond the rules, and sometimes not even that).

@Josh Greer ... who is running 3UCs in bracket play? I need to come work there!

 

[YoungBuck]

@YoungBuck ... what are some of the alternatives you've seen popping up?

Since my daughter finished playing a long time ago, I'm out of the loop on this stuff. As an umpire, I show up and work the field they tell me to. I know nothing about how the brackets or tournament is set up (beyond the rules, and sometimes not even that).

@Josh Greer ... who is running 3UCs in bracket play? I need to come work there!

Ten states currently offer American Legion Softball. It is in it's infancy compared to baseball however in a few decades the numbers will likely rise. And don't get me wrong I am not suggesting that the alternatives can compete with the top level of travel events, but in that same breath how many DDs out there go on to play for Power 5 schools?

The biggest mirage in softball at the moment is that you need to play on a high level travel team to make it to 'NW Forgotten State.'