Tournament changes?

[ms244]

So our team enters a local tournament but only 8 teams enter and there are a few teams that have player conflicts with High School homecoming. So the tournament organizer decides early in the week that the tournament moved to a Sat/Sun tourney to a Sunday only tourney. No big deal.

Specifics on the tournament

• 4 Game Guarantee (Weather Permitting) • 3 Game Pool Play seeded into Single Elimination Tournament • Tournament Bracket may be split into Gold/Silver Divisions (based off number of entries) • USSSA National Berths awarded in each age division • Team Trophies and Individual Player Awards •

So we arrive at the tournament today and find out that the tournament changed. We played 3 pool play games (we went 2-1) and then were told that we will play the 2nd place team in the other pool, and that was it. No elimination bracket. no second game if we win. Nothing. No chance to work into the championship game regardless if we win (which we did).

So the tournament host had both of their teams that was entered in the final game and awarded the state berth and the championship to the team without a playoff.

Sorry for my rant, but after a long day at the ball field it is disappointing to see our players play so hard but to come up short on playing in the championship game that they earned.

Anyone else have this problem or is this an isolated issue. This was an USSSA sanctioned event. Contact them?

 

[GOINGDEEP]

What was the set up for seeding the top in each pool? You said your team went 2-1 and played the #2 team in the other pool. Did the 1st place teams in each pool go 3-0 or win by tie record and revert to RA, RS, etc?

 

[ms244]

They may have seeded it like you posted, but with our win we should have played the winner of the other gold game playoff. The tourney was changed to only play 1 game after pool play. We waited over 3-1/2 hours after our last pool play game to play a team for nothing. No medals, no chance to play in the championship, nothing. The director (a team from the winning organization team) changed the format.

We learned our lesson. We won't be playing any more tournaments hosted by this organization in the future. Very poorly ran, no communication and they obviously changed the format to suit their team. The bottom line is that they awarded a State tournament berth to one of their teams without even having a playoff. Some call it poor planing, I call it "foul".

 

[GOINGDEEP]

Believe me I understand your anger, I hate when a tourney changes pools or formats.

So you were #1 seed in your pool, or #2? Cause the by the change the #1 in each pool should have played for champ. Kinda a hybrid round robin format. Now if you were #1 and didnt play the other #1, I'd be calling U trip first thing tomorrow. Let me know if I'm understanding you right.

Over the years in fall, I had to understand that sometimes tournaments change just to be able to play. Because of school sports or activities. Just part of the game.

 

[CoogansBluff]

It's not good to change the format after it is advertised a certain way, but I'd like to hear the tournament director's side of the story. Perhaps he/she told coaches of the dilemma caused by homecoming and the consensus was to play it on Sunday and go to a round-robin format. Perhaps the tournament director notified coaches of the format change and your coach failed to understand it or communicate it with his parents.

Also, if the format is a round-robin in which the two first-place teams play for the title, I feel like that's a legitimate way to play a tournament. And if it's a one-day, Sunday tournament, it might be the more practical way of doing it. With double-elim and a 4-game guarantee for 8 teams, it's possible for a team to play 8 games in a day. And if it's Sunday, you've got to go to school the next morning.

Also, if you were 2-1 and another team (that beat you) was 3-0, then you didn't deserve to play for the championship -- under this format.

You also point out that two 'host' teams played for the title. If the format was set up before any games were played and then followed, then that's just the way it worked out. No reason to suspect favoritism, IMO. You say that you found out that it was not double-elimination AFTER pool play. If the tournament director didn't communicate that to anyone until that point, and everyone expected double-elimination to begin, there's a big problem. That would be surprising and unusual, though.

 

[JAD]

Don't know all of the details, but any time a tournament is changed from a two day to a one day event there are going to be changes in the format. All changes should have been conveyed BEFORE the tournament to your teams coach/manager and each team should have the opportunity to pull out of the tournament with a full refund if they elect not to participate. Sunday tournaments are more difficult because the tournament director needs to be concerned with the final game start time in order to get everyone home at a decent hour.

That said, it is not uncommon when there are two separate brackets/pools in a tournament to have the winner of each bracket/pool play in a championship game. It sounds like your team and the other second place team played a 'consolation game' for 3rd and 4th place. The other option would have been a 4 game playoff with the winner of each bracket/pool playing the 2nd place team in the other bracket/pool with the winners of those games meeting in a championship game. That option would add an extra game (1.5 hours) to the tournament.

 

[ms244]

I agree with many of the points posted. The decision to make it a single day tournament was made early in the week. The decision to not play a single elimination bracket was made the day of. It was and still is posted on the USSSA website as a single day, single elimination BRACKET tournament. It was never to be a round-robin tournament. Some times coaches hold back a pitcher for elimination game against the team they feel they will face in the final. If the coaches/parents/players knew ahead of time that the tournament was a modified "round robin" tournament maybe they would play their players differently.

Maybe it sounds like I am complaining or bitter about not playing in the championship game. That is not the message that I am trying to make. I am disappointed that the tournament director is allowed to make changes like I have described, to stack the deck in their favor without notice. Did we "deserve" to play in the championship game? I would like to think we would have played in the championship game if the originally posted bracket that we signed up for was ran like it is posted. Our girls deserve better than they received yesterday.

 

[GOINGDEEP]

The decision to not play a single elimination bracket was made the day of. It was and still is posted on the USSSA website as a single day, single elimination BRACKET tournament.

I'm not taking up for the TD, believe me I've had a few choice words with them on botched tournaments. Before you call U trip, I'd make double sure from the coaches exactly when/why the format changed. If it was Sunday morning that should have given ample time for teams to adjust, if it was done late in the day that raises questions. Was it changed due to time restrictions? ( lights, anticipation of champ game late for a school night ) Or changed to assure 2 local teams got a berth?

Very few update online once the tournament is closed. Most updates are emailed straight to the head coaches.

Maybe it sounds like I am complaining or bitter about not playing in the championship game. That is not the message that I am trying to make. I am disappointed that the tournament director is allowed to make changes like I have described, to stack the deck in their favor without notice.

It's never complaining if you have a legit complaint. Is this the first time you played for this TD? U trip in our area is usually very good at handling legit complaints about tournaments. If you find out more from the coaches or decide to call U trip, let us know what you find out for future reference.


Oh yea, you said the 2 day tourney was changed because of homecoming events? I thought all those were held on Friday night?