When Does Winning Become Important?

[BobInMadison]

Winning may be more important to the kids than some of the posters think.

I think about DD #1's freshman year in HS. She had a great softball summer before that, even getting 3rd place in a real tournament.
That fall, her 14u rec league team lost every game. At one point she and her best friend were so discouraged they wanted to quit the team in the middle of a double header. (A DFP poster was one of the coaches for the OTHER team ). I wouldn't let them.
DD #1 was also on a 16u TB team. The star pitcher broke her hand in a scrimmage, which they lost. They played in a tourney that fall, and lost both pool games. They were going to play some weak teams in bracket play, but rained out.
DD #1 quit softball after that.
She did come back in the spring to play for her school's freshman team. They only won 2 games that spring, and some of the losses were real heart breakers.

DD #1 never played a game of softball after that.

 

[Lobster Birch]

Competing is more important than winning. Competing and winning is the best, but competing and losing is second best.

 

[sluggers]

the manager says his part and asks me if I have anything. I sat for a second and said to the girls ...

Which is why I wish "post-game" chats by coaches were illegal.

 

[Rocketech1]

Kids under the age of 14YOA or so aren't competing or trying to win. They are just trying to make their parents/coach happy. Winning and losing at that age is not for the kids, it is for the parents.

I'm not so sure about this. I remember in elementary school we would go down to the park to play football. We picked teams and I can tell you for a fact that each team was trying to win the game. Had nothing to do with the parents and certainly there were no coaches around.

Another example was my first year of rec soccer as an 8yo. Star Wars was very popular and we were named "The Force". At half-time, our teammates would play the first half of the Queen's song "We Will Rock You" and after the game when we won (which was a lot), we played the second half of the song "We Are the Champions". We played the championship game at night under the lights for the first time and we won the game. My parents could have cared less whether we won or not. They knew nothing about soccer and just liked watching their kids play.

 

[Jquick823]

Which is why I wish "post-game" chats by coaches were illegal.

Illegal? You must have been part of or have witnessed some terrible post game chats. I think the car ride home with some parents is much more of an issue than post game chats with the coaches for the girls.

 

[CoogansBluff]

I think the car ride home with some parents is much more of an issue than post game chats with the coaches for the girls.

There definitely should be a designated driver program in youth sports.

 

[Seattlecoach]

What happened to "winning isn't everything but the will to win is" ??

As coaches, especially for young girls, its our jobs to put them in situations to grow and get better. That means doing things like starting Sally at ss sometimes even though Suzie is better and making sure Betty is getting in games because even though she's the worst player on the team she shows up to every practice and game with a good attitude and is getting better every day. It also means realizing a team beating up B teams isn't being challenged and its ok to lose to good A teams, or older teams depending on the skill level.

It also means that though we won't win every game teaching every girl its there job to do everything they can (honorable of course, not teaching them to cheat or take short cuts) to help the team win, no matter the situation they are placed. Even though Sally isn't our best ss if she is playing the position she is doing it to her best ability with the intention to help the team win. If Suzie wants to hit but is called to bunt thats her role in helping the team. Creating a culture that even when players are on the bench they are still engaged and doing everything they can in that situation to support the team whether that be communicating on bunts/steals or cheering on their pitcher.

As a (recent) former player I've won a lot and lost a lot and can say from my personal experience losing a hard fought battle against a good competitor has stayed with me a lot more than winning championships in divisions my team should never have been playing in. Young players don't know the feeling of a team truly working together for a common goal until they've experienced it but once you have its hard to accept anything less, regardless of the outcome.

 

[canyonjoe]

Winning in a team sport can be so over rated. I remember a friend who played little league with me. His team won championships. He played 2 inning a game and batted once. Maybe got 2 hits his entire career. Or the backup QB's in the NFL. Cliff Stoudt won 2 Super bowls. Is he better than Marino? Little League coaches who have kids tank tryouts to win titles and think they are building winners. The winners are the kids who continue to play hard when they are down 10-0. They know when not to rub it in to the other team. They are the first one to console a teammate who made the last out. When asked to play right field they back up every throw,etc.

I do however think that always losing is a problem for kids. It's one thing to never win a championship, but it's another to lose every game. For rec any league where they have an undefeated team and a team that loses all their games is doing something wrong.

 

[GoCaboNow]

This is an interesting topic for me today. I just finished the toughest rec season I have ever coached, and likely my last. It was my DD's last year as 10U and it is clear to me that she has outgrown rec so we will be moving on. I love the developmental aspect of it and I absolutely love working with SOME of the girls that I get to work with, but the stress of dealing with the other families that flat out don't care has just become too much of a burden to handle anymore. We lost every game this season. Our league has a 5 run per inning limit and my DD and I were talking about the season before the game. She told me she wanted to catch since it was the last game but she said that she would understand if I wanted her to play third if it would help the team more. I told her that it wouldn't matter since we both already knew what the score book would look like after the game was over. I can look at the runs scored in every inning of my games this season and tell you which kids batted in those innings. Our games never last more than 3 innings and we bat all 12 kids so our scores always go 5-2-4, 5-5-1, 3-5-3, etc. I have 6 girls that have improved over the season and 6 kids that have somehow gotten worse than they were when we started. It is clear that their parents expected me to teach them to play softball and make them better, unfortunately, they didn't bring them to the 3 official practices we got to have before the season or to any of the unofficial practices that I held every Saturday on my own time that I always spend with my DD at the ball fields.

That is an incredibly long winded introduction to my point. My DD and one of my AC's DDs are really good ball players. My DD has been playing travel basketball on a team that I coach for the last 4 years where winning matters. We are seeded in the end of year tournament based on our record and we play representing our local schools so there are some pretty intense rivalries. I think this has made her far more competitive than my AC's DD even though his DD plays travel softball. His DD does not get as bothered by the lack of effort from the rec teammates as my DD. My DD has left the last 3 games red faced and on the verge of tears of anger from the lack of effort from her team. Last night she was making every throw for runners stealing bases but didn't get a single out because her teammates weren't applying tags or covering bags. She dropped one third strike and almost knocked out our F3 because she wasn't looking for the ball until it got right on her and yelled at her when she didn't touch the bag after she caught it so the runner was safe. I had to talk her down before she got into the dugout after the last inning because I was honestly afraid that she was going to get into a fight with someone. So, I do think that winning matters more to some kids than it does others and it is our job as parents and coaches to recognize that and to nurture and guide it into a productive force. The fiery teammate that cares can be a huge benefit to a team but can also be a destructive terror if pointed in the wrong direction.

I explain to my basketball team every year when we get started that every game counts but that they can't be concerned with the scoreboard during the game. I will pay attention to those things and make coaching decisions. Their job is to play ball. The same thing goes for my softball teams. I don't care what the scoreboard says. They can't change the way they play based on score. If I need to change strategy then I will, but they just have to execute what they are asked to do. There are no 4 point jump shots and there are no 6 run home runs.

This is very similar in make up to DD 10u rec team. We have three that can bat, two that, hopefully, are emerging and five that have never held a bat before or have that much interest in it outside of the games and practices they have to go to. Is not a competitve group outside the first three. They have not really tasted the fire of competing in any other sport and is hard to understand the drive it takes to compete, even at 10u rec. We have been lucky to win half our games. One win was against a second year 10u team. Nine year old DD pitched a fantastic game and only allowed two runs (walks) and we managed to scrape out a win against girls that looked like monsters compared to our relatively young and un-accomplished team. After the game I was so proud of the team for competing against this much larger, older, and experienced, team. We huddled up, I wanted to see the look in their eyes when I tried to tell them how good the team was we just beat. Lol, most just looked at me and wanted to get to the snacks. That's rec.

 

[Jojo]

Which is why I wish "post-game" chats by coaches were illegal.

My DD HATED these! Decided if she ever coached she would never do them!

Ended up coaching high school and partially stuck to it. Post game was quick, gave out some credit and kudos where it was due, and left all the stuff that needed to be worked on for next practice.